Journey's End 1.4.4: Balance Feedback and Discussion Thread

[SsIras]

1. Improved Graveyard crafting or improved "Drunk world" seed to contain all items. These two already make it so close to having one world for one character, perfect for a Journey mode Research playthrough!

2. Give the Steampunker in the Graveyard the Solution for the alternate evil. Dryad can do it, and so should the Steampunker at some point.

3. Late/endgame Biome control. Anything that improves upon the outdated mid-Hardmode Clentaminator, please! Hellevator-ing the world is tedious and ruins the world. Biome spread late game isn't even a challenge anyway.

4. Check some of the new Master mode drop rates, they're obscenely low. Stellar Tune for example could have been one of EoL's drops with equal chance to get it.

5. Yoyos pretty much overshadow (at least in versatility, which counts a lot in Master mode) all other weapons till post-Golem.

6. Merchant rarity RNG, at least improve it in Expert and Master modes.

7. Some mini-bosses can spawn literally the moment you kill the current one, ala Martian Saucer.

8. Some accessories are still useless, ala Fire Gauntlet (and so are some weapons, ala Terrablade vs Influx Waver).

9. Revert to old "every accessory can be in a Vanity slot". It frees up inventory, and allows for quick gear/playstyle change. In fact, a lot of games for decades now have a gear swap functionality anyway. Add a cooldown if neccessary.

10. For no hit runs, NPCs should also drop a Tombstone, not just for Hardcore characters. Or for "nobody dies" runs, allow some form of making a Tombstone, maybe from a Boss' relics or something?

11. Apparently Journey mode with Master difficulty in "For the worthy" seed has tougher scaling than the regular Master Mode difficulty in the same seed. Which makes Journey+Master+FtW actually the hardest possible challenge for reasons yet to be explained to community.

12. Add some missing items in fishing Crates. Best examples are Pyramid loot not being in any Crate, or the Blowpipe, or the Sharpening station.

13. Master mode should generally behave like "For the worthy" seed does. Current mindset of just inflating numbers becomes progressively more tedious than challenging the more you play.

5. Hm... not really? They're good for single target damage and that's all. And recently with the flail buff we got some flails who do more damage at a better range. Some yoyos are extremely good though, so I wouldn't dismiss that point and ignore that fact.

7. Can you list more? I don't think that's a problem, since that's what you're hunting it anyway, I even miss the days of chain Martian Saucer spawn because of this. I do see how it makes it harder to survive certain events, but I don't think these are too much of a problem (martian madness was changed because it was near impossible to dodge saucers death beam, the chain spawns would cause you to instantly die and the only viable strategy to survive that was to lock yourself inside a box.)

8. Fire Gauntlet was addressed (as well as any accessories I could think of that fit here). Terra Blade... yeah, I can say it's not as hard to get as people think, and there is little reason to bump it up a tier. Also, this is too much generalization, "some accessories", "some weapons", if there's more, please list them, this is the item balance thread (we are actually supposed to be listing underpowered/overpowered items, you may have read some discussions here that has nothing to do with that though).

10. Why not just play hardcore then? You aren't getting hit, right? And challenge runs shouldn't receive official support anyway, you aren't meant to do that, you can beat the game ignoring the existence of graveyards completely, just think of it as part of the run.

12. This was discussed here extensively.

13. This was also discussed here extensively.

But you spend the entirety of your pre-hardmode and early hardmode gathering resources for the Terra Blade. Why should it be overshadowed by a literal boss item drop you can kill in less than a minute?

Terra Blade has a fancy crafting recipe and it is a powerful weapon. That's what it needs to be. Martian Madness is a very tough event, and I think claiming that getting the Influx Blade is easy is dismissive. You have to spends minutes looking for a martian probe in space, you have to fight hordes of aliens and you will probably have to do the event multiple times. On average I did say it is faster to get all of Night's Edge components than get the Influx Waver. Even then, the time you get to get an item shouldn't justify it being more powerful. Sure, it should be taken into account, but it's unfair to make everything that you work slightly harder for the strongest option. Adamantite vs Hallowed armor is an example, you get overall better stats and a better defensive power with Hallowed, which you make no effort to obtain besides normal boss progression, while Adamantite armor is very hard to get, but you will almost always get a worse deal out of it), but Hallowed is a post mech bosses armor, and Adamantite can be obtained early in hardmode.

You get an achievement for acquiring the Terra Blade; the item is outclassed by some non-final boss drop. Plus you can only toggle solar eclipses after Golem. Terra Blade needs to justify the hassle it takes you to craft it. Or make a true version of the blade, but that's not coming any time soon.

You also get an achievement for minishark and rainbow rod. You can summon the solar eclipse right after Plantera. It's not hard to get Terra Blade, you barely need luck (unlike Influx Waver), just kill a few Mothrons, you probably will have materials to craft all components of the Night's Edge just from exploring until this point. I did say the hardest part of it is finding a demon altar.

 

[J Bame]

Situation A:
Band of Starpower is a fairly critical piece of many mage build tinkers, but is more or less Corruption exclusive, with the only way to get it being Hardmode-Graveyard seeds and fishing it up out of a Biome Crate (pretty significant hoops to jump through).

What if we could turn the Panic Necklace into a Band of Starpower in a Graveyard, and viceversa? Maybe add a material like Vile/Vicious Powder or Tissue Samples/Shadow Scales.

Also, now that we are at it, I think the entire crafting tree needs a bit of a rework, there are a lot of effects that just randomly go away as it goes on:

Mana Regeneration Band loses the Health regeneration aspect of Band of Regeneration, then the boosted mana regen disappears when upgrading to Magic Cuffs (we can assume it "evolves" into the Cuffs effect, but still), and then finally the +20 mana from Band of Starpower goes away when getting Celestial Cuffs. There is also the 1 defense from the Shackle but no one really cares about that.

Why not make it so that the Magic Cuffs require just the Band of Starpower and the Shackle, and then turn the Mana Regeneration band into a little sidegrade with the Health regen included?

Situation B:

My take:

* Make True Night's Edge require 10 Souls of Might and Night. This essentially moves it from Post-Mech to "Post-1-Mech", letting you use it on the other two, and also gives Melee a second weapon to craft with Mech Souls (Ranger and Magic already get two, it's only fair). Maybe revert the 1.4 buff, though.

* Make True Excalibur require the 3 Mech Souls and 10 of Light. This does make it so Excalibur gets replaced immediately after defeating mechs so it's only usable in the little time inbetween but... Excalibur is just pretty bad already. If the idea is to make True Night's Edge obtainable before True Excalibur by locking the latter behind something exclusive to Pre-Plantera, then you'd just use the former until you get that material. There is no real reason to prefer a sword with a projectile over another without one, unless the difference in DPS is massive, and with Excalibur that isn't the case. There is also not a lot of room for buffs to it without making it weirdly lose stats after upgrading to the True version.

* Move Mothron to Post Plantera entirely, and put Broken Hero Sword back into Terra Blade's recipe (then maybe give it like a 5% damage buff or something to compensate). It's already kinda weird that its drops are split between two tiers, and this also makes Death Sickle and the Chloro Swords more important on their stage of progression.

Unrelated, but during all of this talk about Excalibur and True Night's Edge, Gungnir is crying in the corner, being directly outclassed by Mushroom Spear which is also available at the exact same time. Maybe give it longer range by reducing the base Use Time (that's how spears work, yes) and then make it give iframes-per-hit to buff it and declone it from Mushroom a bit?

 

[Leinfors]

yes... just because something is rare that doesn't mean it should outclass weapons of a later tier.
The terra blade is faster than the influx waiver to the point where if you can reliable hit multiple targets it will actually do more dps.
The tera blade may be weaker than the influx waiver in most situation but it is still one of the strongest pre plantera weapons.

I think you are missing the point of the endeavor. It is FORCED to be weak because it comes so early. And making it come so early is a mistake I'm trying to remedy.

I want to make it come later, in a more streamlined and tier-progressive manner, so I can give it the substantial buffs that I believe it needs. It may not be "better" than Influx Weaver, but it should be a fairly strong and viable weapon leading into the end-game.

Are the Corruptor, Icy Merman, and Gastropod banners working properly? I'm on Journey-Master Mode, and my defense of 77 should be the same for all of the following.

With them in place I get hurt more by an Icy Mer-spit (222 base according to the wiki, roughly 7 or so hearts) than I do a banner'd Corrupt Mimic (270 wiki, about 4-4.5 hearts) body touch. Banner'd Gastropod laser (150 wiki, 3-4 hearts). Corruptor's spit does 4-5 hearts (spit damage isn't listed on the wiki, though it says it does "much more damage" than the 180 listed, it's 5-6 hearts, and I am immune to the weak debuff.)

This is a limitation of the Banner system, one I sought to remedy in this update. Unfortunately, it required a HEAVY rework of the system, because there are several dozen projectiles which are not directly linked to enemies. Things like "Flaming Arrows" are fired by quite a few enemies. We couldn't just add Flaming Arrows to, say, Pirate Crossbower Banner, because it is also fired by Skeleton Archers. So we would have needed to implement a system which assigned "ownership" to projectiles in a way that was compatible with the Banner system, and due to the time constraints of that, it was not something we were able to do.

In response to Situation A, make the Band of Starpower craftable from a Panic Necklace + Mana Crystal at a Tinkerer's Workshop (And the Panic Necklace crafted from a Band of Starpower + Heart Crystal). This makes them slightly more work to get since you'd need to beat a Goblin Invasion, but still obtainable before any boss.

This feels VERY symmetrical and clean to me. I'm going to put this one on my Proposal Candidate lists. I like it a lot.

What if we could turn the Panic Necklace into a Band of Starpower in a Graveyard, and viceversa? Maybe add a material like Vile/Vicious Powder or Tissue Samples/Shadow Scales.

Also, now that we are at it, I think the entire crafting tree needs a bit of a rework, there are a lot of effects that just randomly go away as it goes on:

Mana Regeneration Band loses the Health regeneration aspect of Band of Regeneration, then the boosted mana regen disappears when upgrading to Magic Cuffs (we can assume it "evolves" into the Cuffs effect, but still), and then finally the +20 mana from Band of Starpower goes away when getting Celestial Cuffs. There is also the 1 defense from the Shackle but no one really cares about that.

Graveyard crafting was one potential candidate I've been considering. My concern is that it would immediately invite expectations of cross-evil crafting for ALL of the drops (which is not in the cards), and so is not necessarily the best solution. It is a passable one, however.

Fixing the missing +20 mana on the Cuffs is on my proposal list. Keeping the HP Regen on the advanced recipes is not, however, since I think its clear at that point that they take a direction towards Mana orientation.

* Make True Night's Edge require 10 Souls of Might and Night. This essentially moves it from Post-Mech to "Post-1-Mech", letting you use it on the other two, and also gives Melee a second weapon to craft with Mech Souls (Ranger and Magic already get two, it's only fair). Maybe revert the 1.4 buff, though.

* Make True Excalibur require the 3 Mech Souls and 10 of Light. This does make it so Excalibur gets replaced immediately after defeating mechs so it's only usable in the little time inbetween but... Excalibur is just pretty bad already. If the idea is to make True Night's Edge obtainable before True Excalibur by locking the latter behind something exclusive to Pre-Plantera, then you'd just use the former until you get that material. There is no real reason to prefer a sword with a projectile over another without one, unless the difference in DPS is massive, and with Excalibur that isn't the case. There is also not a lot of room for buffs to it without making it weirdly lose stats after upgrading to the True version.

* Move Mothron to Post Plantera entirely, and put Broken Hero Sword back into Terra Blade's recipe (then maybe give it like a 5% damage buff or something to compensate). It's already kinda weird that its drops are split between two tiers, and this also makes Death Sickle and the Chloro Swords more important on their stage of progression.

Unrelated, but during all of this talk about Excalibur and True Night's Edge, Gungnir is crying in the corner, being directly outclassed by Mushroom Spear which is also available at the exact same time. Maybe give it longer range by reducing the base Use Time (that's how spears work, yes) and then make it give iframes-per-hit to buff it and declone it from Mushroom a bit?

I think Mothron to post-Plantera is one of the easiest changes I can make here that would simplify the situation, with the BHS being required only for Terra Blade, and not the True Swords. I'm fairly confident in that part of the equation, if I can resolve the crafting situation for the True Swords.

In an ideal world . . . Terra Blade would be post-Golem, I think. But I see even less of a clean way to do that, aside from locking Mothron behind Golem, and I don't think I can swing that one, it would require rebalancing multiple items to account for it, and probably buffing Mothron as well. Too much damage left in its wake.

As for the whole Excalibur/True Excalibur situation, I think True Excalibur has room to grow, it could support buffs. Its biggest limitation is that if I buff it too much, it invalidates Terra Blade, which could not be similarly buffed in turn. This re-arrangement will probably allow me to buff all three.

If True Ex/NE < Terra Blade as a flat expectation, then True Ex/NE are limited by Terra Blade's power. Increase the cap on Terra Blade's power, then you can increase True Ex/NE accordingly.

All of this re-arrangement is intended to free my hands balance wise to facilitate such a situation.

 

[VDragunov]

On review, yes, Cursed Inferno and Venom are doing half as much as I had intended them to do. They are still buffed substantially from how much they WERE doing, but the code has a 2x divider on DoT effects that was unclear to me, so the end result is less than expected.

This should be remedied in my balance review patch.

On an unrelated note, I have two particular scenarios that I'd be interested in ideas/solutions for. One of them has already been discussed heavily in this thread, though I'm not 100% satisfied with the ideas proposed, and the other is new.

So,

Situation A:
Band of Starpower is a fairly critical piece of many mage build tinkers, but is more or less Corruption exclusive, with the only way to get it being Hardmode-Graveyard seeds and fishing it up out of a Biome Crate (pretty significant hoops to jump through).

Goal:
Find a clean way to offer cross-world access to it that would also allow symmetrical application to the Panic Necklace.

Limitations:
- Can't require the addition of new items
- Ideally wouldn't remove the Band of Starpower from the Shadow Orb loot pool
- Can be symmetrically applied to Panic Necklace
- If its locked to Hardmode, its barely an improvement on the current method, so that is likely not a great solution
- Whatever solution is made here is not likely to be applied to the rest of the Corruption/Crimson alternates. This is exclusively oriented at the Band of Starpower (and the Panic Necklace due to symmetry).

There have been a lot of ideas tossed around in the thread, including putting it in Gold Chests, putting it in Sky Chests, making it craftable, etc. Right now, none of them feel quite right. I know "where I want to get to", but I'm not satisfied with a quality solution to doing so, and if we can't find an ideal solution, then it might not be something that we can do.


Situation B:
Terra Blade, True Night's Edge, and True Excalibur are fundamentally difficult to balance as a result of their source and tiering. On paper, they are the exact same tier, because once you get both of them, you can immediately upgrade to Terra Blade. This means that the Terra Blade can't be "as good as it deserves" because its actually the same tier as the True Swords, which limits it. It also means that the True Swords can't be as good as THEY deserve, because you need to reserve "upward mobility" for the Terra Blade. All 3 weapons suffer for it.

But that's not the only problem. Technically speaking, their tier is post-Mech. You can get these weapons as soon as you've beaten the 3 mechs. However, it is HEAVILY RNG locked, with Solar Tablets being locked to just before Golem. This is highly problematic, because if I balance them for post-Mech/pre-Plantera, they aren't strong enough when you are LIKELY to get them. But if I balance them for pre-Golem/post-Golem, then they are WAY too strong if you get them early. So, with that all said!

Goal:
1. Separate the tier of the Terra Blade from the True Swords. The True Swords should be unlocked at an earlier tier than Terra Blade, so that they do not immediately upgrade into it. This allows all 3 weapons to fulfill their own niches and have room to grow and stand on their own.
2. Figure out a solution to the Broken Hero Sword/Eclipse situation, so that the "tier" of the weapon isn't smeared across 2 and a half in-game tiers.
3. Ultimately, Terra Blade should be stronger than it is, but it is difficult to just buff it while it is currently hamstrung by the two issues stated above. Resolving the above two issues will allow me to buff Terra Blade, and probably both of the True Swords as well.

Limitations:
- It is unlikely that a new item will be added to allow for the crafting here
- True Excalibur's unlock must be, at minimum, post-3-mech, but the easier it is to unlock, the less room it has to grow over Excalibur
- The more space put between Terra Blade and the True Swords, the more they can stand apart
- Broken Hero Sword is not going away, but a sufficiently compelling argument could be made to see it moved to a different source. It could theoretically be only used for Terra Blade, and not for the True Swords.

I've done a lot of brainstorming on both of the above and I'm just not satisfied with any of the solutions we've come up with. Most of them have logistical issues that either make them ineffective at accomplishing the intended purpose, or mean they are likely to be turned down by Redigit.

I'm interested in any ideas you guys have to offer.

Based on what I've read from comments coming afer this one... You should do more of these, since it really helps us focus on giving feedback to what needs to be balanced.

I only can give my input on situation B, however, as I really liked the "Band of Starpower + Heart Crystal" solution someone else gave!

Aesthetically, it would be pleasing to go Night's Edge > Excalibur > TNE > TEX > Terra Blade. However, since the TNE looks like it could use some Chlorophyte in it's upgrade... well, there's nothing wrong with delaying it's upgrade, if anything, it would be pleasant to "finally" return to that weapon you had stashed since early-hardmode and upgrade it with some clorophyte. Both things are extremely close in tier anyway (You need the three types of souls to get the pickaxe axe / drax and mine chlorophyte anyway), so the difference in the true version of both swords should be left to taste, making the Terra Blade a true fusion of both.

Excalibur should remain the faster sword (both to get and to use), and Night's Edge the more powerful one. Then you get the raw power of the Night's Edge and the speed of the Excalibur on the Terra Blade.

I like the idea of moving Mothron to post-plantera, solar eclipse is tough as it is without it, and once you've beat plantera, you can reliably summon the solar eclipse from loot in the temple.

Tl;dr:
Excalibur + all 3 souls = True Excalibur.
Night's Edge + Chlorophyte+ True Night's Edge.
Both True Blades + a Broken Hero Sword = Terra Blade.

On a side note, can you make it so excalibur gets a piercing projectile and the true night's edge becomes a mini-influx waver? I know it'd be weird for the fusion of both weapons to lose the influx-waver property, but it'd be neat to have a taste of both weapons at a lower tier (it would also help to further set the two apart if they were mini-versions of those two: one more useful for bossing, the other against crowds)

That requires getting the absurdly rare bloody tear in the first place

It's... really not that rare, I even got it on my first (IRL) day on journey mode.

All I did was set up a lava trap, freeze time as soon as the event started, set up spawn rate to x10, and just wait. I even got like three Money Troughs in the process, even though some NPCs died (set the trap too close to a town, my bad) and thus my luck was set to a lower value...

But outside of journey mode, though... yeah, it should be buffed.

 

[Leinfors]

On a side note, can you make it so excalibur gets a piercing projectile and the true night's edge becomes a mini-influx waver? I know it'd be weird for the fusion of both weapons to lose the influx-waver property, but it'd be neat to have a taste of both weapons at a lower tier (it would also help to further set the two apart if they were mini-versions of those two: one more useful for bossing, the other against crowds)

Overhauling their functionality to that degree is outside of my scope. I can add piercing, but changing the general behavior of True Night's Edge's projectile is unlikely to happen.

 

[VDragunov]

Overhauling their functionality to that degree is outside of my scope. I can add piercing, but changing the general behavior of Terra Blade's projectile is unlikely to happen.

So you could make the true excalibur a mini-terra blade, but turning the true night's edge into a mini-influx waver is a no-go? bummer... How about giving one pierce and the other a small homing effect? (Nothing too drastic, just something to make them more likely to hit) it would still help to set them apart.

 

[SsIras]

Situation B:
Terra Blade, True Night's Edge, and True Excalibur are fundamentally difficult to balance as a result of their source and tiering. On paper, they are the exact same tier, because once you get both of them, you can immediately upgrade to Terra Blade. This means that the Terra Blade can't be "as good as it deserves" because its actually the same tier as the True Swords, which limits it. It also means that the True Swords can't be as good as THEY deserve, because you need to reserve "upward mobility" for the Terra Blade. All 3 weapons suffer for it.

But that's not the only problem. Technically speaking, their tier is post-Mech. You can get these weapons as soon as you've beaten the 3 mechs. However, it is HEAVILY RNG locked, with Solar Tablets being locked to just before Golem. This is highly problematic, because if I balance them for post-Mech/pre-Plantera, they aren't strong enough when you are LIKELY to get them. But if I balance them for pre-Golem/post-Golem, then they are WAY too strong if you get them early. So, with that all said!

Goal:
1. Separate the tier of the Terra Blade from the True Swords. The True Swords should be unlocked at an earlier tier than Terra Blade, so that they do not immediately upgrade into it. This allows all 3 weapons to fulfill their own niches and have room to grow and stand on their own.
2. Figure out a solution to the Broken Hero Sword/Eclipse situation, so that the "tier" of the weapon isn't smeared across 2 and a half in-game tiers.
3. Ultimately, Terra Blade should be stronger than it is, but it is difficult to just buff it while it is currently hamstrung by the two issues stated above. Resolving the above two issues will allow me to buff Terra Blade, and probably both of the True Swords as well.

Limitations:
- It is unlikely that a new item will be added to allow for the crafting here
- True Excalibur's unlock must be, at minimum, post-3-mech, but the easier it is to unlock, the less room it has to grow over Excalibur
- The more space put between Terra Blade and the True Swords, the more they can stand apart
- Broken Hero Sword is not going away, but a sufficiently compelling argument could be made to see it moved to a different source. It could theoretically be only used for Terra Blade, and not for the True Swords.

I've done a lot of brainstorming on both of the above and I'm just not satisfied with any of the solutions we've come up with. Most of them have logistical issues that either make them ineffective at accomplishing the intended purpose, or mean they are likely to be turned down by Redigit.

I'm interested in any ideas you guys have to offer.

Oh, I thought more about this and found a way to make sense out of using Chloropyte to be used in crafting of both sword.
Remember how Spectre Bars didn't exist? We can make something like that, we use Chloropyte and Soul of Light in the crafting of true excalibur and Chloropyte and Soul of Night for Night's Edge. Since Chloropyte is also used to craft Spectre and Shroomite, this makes a little more sense to me.

 

[VDragunov]

Another thing that just came to mind: no one's talked about the Terragrim and how extremely rare it has become. It's also weird that you can get enchanted swords from crates, but not the terragrim (trust me, I've been trying, to a point I got several of these---mind you, it was in journey mode after nearly losing my mind in the process to farm 10 golden crates), so... Why not make it craftable from enchanted swords? It could be enchanted swords + anklet of the wind, it's a green accesory that fits with the "Crissagrim/Valmanway" reference the weapon has going for it anyway.

It would still be rare (it requires not one, but two rare materials which are better used elsewhere), but at the very least there would be a reliable alternative to getting it.

Another item that's extremely rare is the demon conch, crafting it from magic conches and ash near lava would be neat, and kind of intuitive. And yeah, you can get one from fishing in lava, but uh... how often can you actually fish in lava without several long trips to the underworld?

 

[Travlordian01⚡️]

Could you move the Terra Blade post-golem by crafting it in a Lihzard furnace?

It still would do nothing because you cane get them pre post golem and plantera, even pre hardmode!

 

[mathbrush]

It still would do nothing because you cane get them pre post golem and plantera, even pre hardmode!

Oh, dang, I thought I deleted it before anyone saw. Yeah, you definitely can't craft it in a Lihzard furnace!

 

[2mg]

. Also, this is too much generalization, "some accessories", "some weapons", if there's more, please list them, this is the item balance thread (we are actually supposed to be listing underpowered/overpowered items, you may have read some discussions here that has nothing to do with that though).

The Panic necklace tree, the Philosophers stone stuff, Cross necklace, Regen band, they all seem like they should be an Ankh-like crafting tree. Also the whole weird tree stemming from Emblems goes into weird directions, losing bonuses just to make more accesories fit into one.

 

[a31337]

Terra Blade has a fancy crafting recipe and it is a powerful weapon. That's what it needs to be. Martian Madness is a very tough event, and I think claiming that getting the Influx Blade is easy is dismissive. You have to spends minutes looking for a martian probe in space, you have to fight hordes of aliens and you will probably have to do the event multiple times. On average I did say it is faster to get all of Night's Edge components than get the Influx Waver. Even then, the time you get to get an item shouldn't justify it being more powerful. Sure, it should be taken into account, but it's unfair to make everything that you work slightly harder for the strongest option. Adamantite vs Hallowed armor is an example, you get overall better stats and a better defensive power with Hallowed, which you make no effort to obtain besides normal boss progression, while Adamantite armor is very hard to get, but you will almost always get a worse deal out of it), but Hallowed is a post mech bosses armor, and Adamantite can be obtained early in hardmode.


You also get an achievement for minishark and rainbow rod. You can summon the solar eclipse right after Plantera. It's not hard to get Terra Blade, you barely need luck (unlike Influx Waver), just kill a few Mothrons, you probably will have materials to craft all components of the Night's Edge just from exploring until this point. I did say the hardest part of it is finding a demon altar.

But it is easy, at least with an arena. I guess we shouldn't call it that way. It is absolutely faster than getting the Terra blade. And the Minishark and rainbow rod are also very powerful weapons. I shouldn't have to ditch an iconic item for a boss drop.

 

[Tyrian3k]

In an ideal world . . . Terra Blade would be post-Golem, I think. But I see even less of a clean way to do that, aside from locking Mothron behind Golem, and I don't think I can swing that one, it would require rebalancing multiple items to account for it, and probably buffing Mothron as well. Too much damage left in its wake.

Well, that is true unless you decide that an item dropped by Golem like the Eye of the Golem is used to crafting the Terra blade, maybe boosting its base crit chance by 10% over the True Swords to incorporate its stats into it. That would allow Mothron to stay where it currently sits without having to change it.

 

[TerrariaGeek401]

So, I gotta say, the True Night's Edge and the True Excalibur are super obsolete. Never once have I found it too difficult to get 3 Broken Hero Swords in the same Solar Eclipse. I have NEVER used one of those swords. Maybe make the Broken Hero Sword a 1/200 drop from all enemies in the Eclipse?
Also, I think the Death Sickle needs a longer range. It always seems obsolete to me.

 

[SsIras]

The Panic necklace tree, the Philosophers stone stuff, Cross necklace, Regen band, they all seem like they should be an Ankh-like crafting tree. Also the whole weird tree stemming from Emblems goes into weird directions, losing bonuses just to make more accessories fit into one.

The Panic Necklace is a thing I can agree should be buffed/reword, though I wouldn't say it should be merged with other accessories. It is the weaker counterpart to Band of Starpower and nearly no one uses it or it's upgrade.
Though the others... Star Veil and Charm of Myths are both very good accessories that compete for slots against expert boss drops a lot of times, making them stronger/merging with a weaker accessory doesn't like a good balance change to me. That's why a lot of accessories have to lose bonus and stop the crafting tree early, so they don't become absolutely broken (they would become Celestial Shell 2.0).

But it is easy, at least with an arena. I guess we shouldn't call it that way. It is absolutely faster than getting the Terra blade. And the Minishark and rainbow rod are also very powerful weapons. I shouldn't have to ditch an iconic item for a boss drop.

Terra Blade IS a powerful weapon. Upon review though, if we make it a post Plantera weapon like we're suggesting here, you would only keep it for a tier before you decide to face the martians. I think that Influx Waver SHOULD be better in general, since would still be a tier higher and I don't agree with Terra Blade being too much harder to get (it is less intuitive, you have to explore many parts of the world, but overall, you will have a tougher time with martian madness than with solar eclipse and that's the events that really matter for both swords).
With that said, if we're making Terra Blade post Plantera, I did suggest a buff to its pierce (maybe +2 pierce but with 75% damage).

EDIT: Just saw Leinfors post and realized the redundancy.
Terra Blade will get a buff if it goes to post-Golem/Plantera.
My suggestion stands that it should be craftable with BHS (which should be either a post-Golem Mothron drop or a post-Plantera Mothron drop).

EDIT 2: To make it more clear how this is possible:
-> Mothron spawns post-Plantera (it drops EoC and Mothron wings)
-> After you defeat Golem, Mothron now also has a chance to drop Broken Hero Swords
-> True Swords are crafted with Chlorophyte and Souls of Night/Light instead of Broken Hero Swords

 

[Travlordian01⚡️]

-> True Swords are crafted with Chlorophyte and Souls of Night/Light instead of Broken Hero Swords

Then what’s the point of getting the broken hero swords now, I think it’s betrer to have the broken hero swords because you are technically fixing them, and makes the swords truer, but you should still include the broken hero sword, or else it’s useless item.

 

[reinaXIX]

Projectiles fired by enemies ignore the damage reduction applied by banners. I believe this is due to how projectiles are coded as separate entities and are not covered by their specific banners.

Furthermore, this is not an easy issue to fix since various enemies share similar projectiles and, incidentally, the projectile ID. Banners, as a result, have been coded to only affect contact damage because it's an issue that is too difficult to fix.

Ah, I see. Cleared up that mystery for me, thanks~

 

[Leinfors]

Then what’s the point of getting the broken hero swords now, I think it’s betrer to have the broken hero swords because you are technically fixing them, and makes the swords truer, but you should still include the broken hero sword, or else it’s useless item.

In my preferred setup, the BHS would be used for Terra Blade, not the True Swords.

 

[Travlordian01⚡️]

In my preferred setup, the BHS would be used for Terra Blade, not the True Swords.

Hmm makes sense, like the old versions of terraria require a broken hero sword to craft

 

[Maza]

In my preferred setup, the BHS would be used for Terra Blade, not the True Swords.

Maybe adding Beetle Husks, Shroomite and Spectre bars to the Terra Blade's recipe? (Only using Husks is a bit weird)
This way Mothron can remain the way it is, but Terra Blade is now post-Golem.
But I also like SsIras' idea.

-> Mothron spawns post-Plantera (it drops EoC and Mothron wings)
-> After you defeat Golem, Mothron now also has a chance to drop Broken Hero Swords
-> True Swords are crafted with Chlorophyte and Souls of Night/Light instead of Broken Hero Swords