CC Creation Compendium #26

Discussion in 'Community Projects' started by darthmorf, May 31, 2015.

  1. darthmorf

    darthmorf Party Girl

    It is up to them who they are influenced by, and how the develop. You like it one way, they like it another.
     
  2. W1K

    W1K Witch

    I honestly think constant practice is not fun. I'm an hobbyist artist (a really mediocre one) and my main focus is practicing game designing and programming. I don't exactly have the time for both, even tho I do enjoy drawing once in a while.
     
    Darthkitten, Plaguerion and darthmorf like this.
  3. Jewsus

    Jewsus Official Terrarian

    I believe in following your own path and if that involves being influenced by someone else's art that's not a bad thing there is no wrong or right in art. I have viewed most of the CC entries since they were on Terraria Online and used to be highly inspired by it I even learn from it. And I even rebuilt a few of them in my own worlds because they looked like so much fun to make. But that's no reason not to do your best and if entrants are doing that then I salute them. If their goal is to improve over time and practice then even better and I commend them not that my commendation means much but I think following an artists lifestyle is a highly admirable one.

    And as for your statement here I think programming is also an art and I like your entry you're quite talented. I have recently started to learn JS and c#... to an artist like me I find them confusing because I have little experience with the languages but in order to get better at it I must try harder and practice or I will not learn.

    Apparently you can teach an old dog like me new tricks.

    And if i recall correctly you made a very nice mod pack for Tconfig I really enjoyed the content you added to the game at the time. I am looking into modding again myself and look forwards to testing any recent content you have made for Tapi(if you make mods for Tapi I haven't looked at it at all so I have no clue on what's made for it atm). So don't be to quick to judge yourself as mediocre. Let the critics do that its what were here for XD
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2015
  4. Kazzymodus

    Kazzymodus Lunatic Cultist

    Effort isn't a binary, you don't give it either your all or your nothing. When I do my perspective studies, I make sure all my lines are clean and go to the vanishing points, but I don't try to create a masterpiece. More importantly, I don't show them to anyone, yet I do show people my mediocre-at-best sprites.

    The same applies to CC: when people make a drawing or a build or anything, I don't think many people see their creation as the peak of their talents, or have made many iterations and chosen the best one. Because they are not trying to show their best, nor does the fact that they don't mean that they don't aspire to improve outside of the CC.
    In my opinion, programming isn't an art, it's a craft. Code in itself does not do anything, it needs a (audio)visual component, be it text, sprites, 3D models or wavebanks to express itself.
    On a side not, I'd advise anyone here not to give criticism to anyone who has not explicitly asked for it, for reasons W1K has already explained.
     
  5. W1K

    W1K Witch

    I do believe it is, mainly due to the fact specific iterations with even minimalistic sprites can do better than properly sprited average coding. Still, it really is a matter of what you define art, considering there's no real definition of it.
     
    Tamorr and darthmorf like this.
  6. Jewsus

    Jewsus Official Terrarian

    Brushing your teeth can be an art if you really want to get into what's art or not lol.
     
  7. Omnir

    Omnir The Destroyer

    Am I the only one that doesn't see an issue with the entries?
     
    Tamorr, Teal, TheQuietBisharp and 2 others like this.
  8. Kazzymodus

    Kazzymodus Lunatic Cultist

    Agreed, discussions like this always boil down to opinions and beliefs. Just to clarify, I don't think programming is 'lesser' to 'proper art', or anything like that. It's a vital component in today's life, we couldn't do without it.
    Yes, but I wasn't planning to get that Socratic.
     
  9. Jewsus

    Jewsus Official Terrarian

    The entries are not an issue. And my main point boils down to doing more art and trying your best and if you're currently doing your best then good... And you don't think that's a good idea to strive to be all you can be then maybe you have to ask yourself why you're in a CC or any activity be it sports the arts or any other endeavour.
    Not saying you have to be good at it but to try is why you do anything that you enter into. You also don't go to the dentist to get laser eye surgery etc. And you would hope that the dentist had a lot of practice in his art because you don't want to come out with a seeing eye dog when all you needed was a filling...
    And if you play a sport I am sure that you want to do it well for your team... Maybe food is a better analogy! Do you like good food? and if you cook for yourself I am sure you like to make it to be the best and most delectable dish you can. After all what isn't more satisfying than a good meal?
    If thinking people should have pride in their work and strive to be more than they are and to break the boundaries of thier potential pushing mediocrity to the side is a bad thing then crown me king of the bad guys :D
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2015
  10. Omnir

    Omnir The Destroyer

    I was lead to believe there were issues with the entries due to "patting yourself on the back for mediocrity", which I'm not seeing in these.

    I'm all for being better, and all for critiques (anyone that knows me knows this). Share techniques you've discovered. But I'll be honest, you came off as a typical negative nancy, which is why a lot of people confronted you on it.
     
  11. Sargon

    Sargon Terrarian

    (I promised to not reply on this matter but I must say that I'm grateful to people who told the exact meaning of Creation Compendiums. It was rather obscure to me so thank you. I still stand for my opinions but they aren't the current subject of the discussion... But okay then. Now I'm REALLY out. You may ignore this post.)
     
  12. Jewsus

    Jewsus Official Terrarian

    This is more accurate than some might think:
     
  13. Khaios

    Khaios Retinazer

    @Jewsus
    I'm not going to disagree with you 100%. I also believe that everyone should strive for their best. I also agree that constructive criticism is a very important part in skill development. That being said, I believe you are going about this entirely the wrong way. It may not have been your intent, but your comments up to this point have insinuated that you feel at least some of the entries in this CC have not put forth their best effort. Because of that, people have been butting heads with you ever since. After all, as others have stated, unless you can see into the thoughts of the individual making a submission, you really have no idea whether or not they gave their best.

    Also, on the topic of constructive criticism, personally, I would love if people gave me more constructive criticism. However, I would want it to be on my private build thread, not a public thread. I agree with the others that this isn't the place for it. I am not saying that constructive criticism shouldn't be given. Personally, I wish that I would receive more of it on my builds, as it would help me figure out places where I can improve. I would want that criticism to be posted on my personal build thread, or via PM, however. In addition, I provide constructive criticism on many builds within this forum. If I feel an individual isn't open to those types of comments, I lay off, as I do not want to push people into not building. Point is, I keep them personal, not generic.

    Next, I would like to point out that what you've been doing is flat criticism through implication.
    I just want to say that all of the "red alert" comments you're seeing is because your criticism has been negative (as in not constructive). When you make oppositional comments, you can expect to see negative replies. I say that your criticism hasn't been constructive for several reasons. Firstly, you started off with a very negative tone, by heavily implying that all the entries are mediocre. Then, you proceed to give an extremely broad and generic tip of "strive to do your best." That statement is not helpful, as it isn't tailored to an individual, and doesn't in any way, shape, or form tell them HOW they might do their best, or HOW they might improve. If you want your criticism to be taken better, you must provide useful feedback, and that feedback must always be altered to fit the individual you're giving it to. Constructive criticism should strive to see the good and bad. Try and be friendly when providing it, be insightful, be specific, and maybe you won't the kind of negative feedback you've been seeing (though I have to point out that there will always be haters).

    Lastly, I'd like to further back @darthmorf when he says this forum isn't the place. If you want your criticism to be constructive, as I've said, you should tailor it to the individual. It is extremely difficult to provide useful feedback to a large group of people, especially if those people aren't working in tandem (for example, the CC, since every entrant is not associated with the others). Giving a generic comment to everyone who submitted an entry won't inspire anyone to improve, and it doesn't give them any information on how to improve. And even if you chose to critique on that level, this still wouldn't be the place. There are simply too many entries for you to help, and it wouldn't be right if you provided useful feedback on some, but ignored others. Bringing up the museum analogy you introduced, nobody would want to walk through an exhibit while having to listen to a random person who walks from piece to piece saying "you guys need to try harder." Just tour the museum and enjoy (or don't) the sights. If you want to help the artist, contact them directly.

    ^.^
     
  14. Jewsus

    Jewsus Official Terrarian

    You take all the negative I say none of the positive you can read it as you like. If you're going to do anything do it well or don't do it at all. The world has enough poor quality stuff in it no need to fill it with more. Try being considerate to the planet and think outside of yourself (people seem to think its their god given right to have everything)... There is a reason to try be the best you can try figure it out sometime.
    And put effort into the things you do because there is such a thing as finite resources so there's no need to waste them on not trying when you can add some effort to make their use at least worth while and IF players are putting in as much effort as they can then that's good IF NOT then why enter into or do anything let alone a CC. You can celebrate mediocrity all you like I am not going to pretend anything is more deserving than the effort that was put in to make it.
    Being the best you can be means many things but it also means you value your surroundings, yourself, and the materials you used to create anything. Even if the creation is only good to you and no one else likes it that isn't the point of the exercise. Its as long as you think you put your all into it and were happy making it. Otherwise have fun being mediocre.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2015
  15. Khaios

    Khaios Retinazer

    It's a shame that you aren't willing to apply the "be your best" when it comes to providing constructive criticism. I don't even know why I bother at this point. It's apparent that you're not really reading what I wrote, and you just blocked it out, probably assuming I was only bashing you. Even still, you should know that negativity will be met with negativity. I was just trying to tell you how you could "be your best" when it comes to giving advice.
     
    MiltVala, TheQuietBisharp and Omnir like this.
  16. Jewsus

    Jewsus Official Terrarian

    Oh I read your post multiple times but you seem to gloss over any positive points I have made and focus on the negative.
    People cant seem to handle negative criticism... Probably because they are to used to being told that they are awesome!
    A lion doesn't kill a wilder beast on the basis of being half assed about it and sure this isn't survival of the fittest but life is far to far removed from nature people seem to have lost touch with striving to be at your peak performance is for many reasons...
    Least of all that you are always improving with practice.

    You didn't build that ship in your signature by not practising did you?
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2015
  17. Khaios

    Khaios Retinazer

    Ironically, you can't seem to handle constructive criticism. Allow me to point out that I agreed with you in that I feel criticism is necessary. I also agreed that people should try their best. Thirdly, I stated that I wished more people would provide constructive criticism towards my builds.

    I was trying to tell you that I believe you are going about this the wrong way. I was not negatively bashing you. I pointed out the good and the bad, and informed you on how I believe you could improve on your critiquing.

    If you'd rather, I could provide negative criticism towards your comments, and see if you like them any more than my constructive one. And for the record, I tried my absolute best to provide positive feedback about your comments, but it is extremely hard to do that when the comments are negative in nature. I'm talking about your initial comments, not when you went off on a tangent and complimented @W1K

    If you want more positive feedback regarding your comments, then simply put, be more positive in your comments. Don't be negative, and expect people to be positive about it (even though I honestly tried).
     
    Teal likes this.
  18. Jewsus

    Jewsus Official Terrarian

    I get that you're not making a personal attack on me and I don't take it as one lol this isn't personal its more I am standing fast to my perspective I am not going to budge on that. Once I make up my mind, and that is usually taken with a good deal of forethought to the consequences of my actions, I stick to my decision because it's extremely cheesy to change your tune on the basis that people may not like you or

    "Jewsus! You're upsetting the other customers. Stop casting 1/2 price spells in the discount store".

    This isn't a popularity contest I am not here for people to like me :D
    Positive feedback must be taken equally with negative or how can you grow?
    You cannot go through life always being told everything you do is awesome or how will you learn?
    Criticism isn't and doesn't always have to be positive to be constructive.
    --- Double Post Merged, Jun 10, 2015, Original Post Date: Jun 10, 2015 ---
    Well I prefer that kind of open honesty its really quite refreshing!

    If someone tells me something I do isn't good I don't quit I try harder and eventually make them eat their words... To be honest though its not about anyone else its more like golf you are really playing against yourself! If your goal is to do poorly then you will but if your goal is to do well then you surely will (of course just thinking it is only half the battle the other half is putting in the effort). If you sit on the fence and idly twiddle your thumbs you're never going to know your full potential are you?
     
  19. Teal

    Teal Eater of Worlds

    You clearly operate on a different mental octave than most, which I can respect. Especially with the rest of the Internet to entertain that. But there are so many problems with your argument here, that isn't at all relevant to the topic. Let me break it down for you, systematically:
    1) Firstly, and most importantly, this isn't the place for criticism, negative or positive. Brief statements are fine, as shown with 'the whole my favorites' and 'I like this one' comments. But this certainly isn't anywhere to discuss the affair you're conversing about, at all.
    2) Your opinions, are just that. Opinions. You can't compare everyone subject to your own interpretation or standards. To tell someone to better themselves, even dwell on that, is not the way to create change. Private Convos, with tips, that aren't derogatory would be more encouraging. People don't learn because someone on the Internet, who I must say sounds decently educated, is mad because everything doesn't meet his internal standards. People will ultimately attack you, or totally disregard you.
    3) This is a showcase, not to show, well as Darthmorf put it 'achievements,' but more as to display what users have created. Be it a half chewed eraser that someone made look like the Nymph's left nipple, or the Mona Lisa.
    4) Hobbyism is what you're against here, which is a problem in my eyes. Especially seeing as your creations are by all means a hobby, which YOU PERSONALLY LIKE to put more detail in.
    5) You're statements have mostly been total reiterations of what you've already said. You don't once challenge or agree with an opinion. To say people can't take criticism is wrong. I've seen lots of users take painfully rude criticism like champs, even many present here. They can't take YOUR criticism, because you're doing something wrong. I have critiqued many literature threads here on the forums, plainly worded and blunt, but not like this. Your trying to criticize works as whole, and focus on some that are unattractive. I don't know how anyone can do that reasonably.
    6) It seems to me you're gravitating towards controversy. Intentionally. You seem to instead of approach it logically, just rewrite what you've already said. To me, I think you're purposely inciting issues, spiraled from your critiques because you see other people receiving positive comments. You can be blunt, shoot hellfire flames, at something someone's done and still give valid criticism. Shouting at people, the same thing over and over, is not how it's done. We have words for what I suspect you're trying to do: Hating, simply because you can.

    I may be wrong, but I think you just need to reassess the way you respond to other people's works, and comment on it.
     
    MiltVala, Khaios, darthmorf and 2 others like this.
  20. Kazzymodus

    Kazzymodus Lunatic Cultist

    Once again, it's not a binary. If you are not given any criticism, that does not mean that you automatically assume that your work is awesome. In fact, I think it's quite the contrary with almost all artists (at least it is with me), always looking at what mistakes they made and how they can learn from them, without the need for anyone to tell them. Therefore any 'need' for criticism on the grounds of 'otherwise they'll never improve' is, with all due respect, bogus.

    If you are in art school, yes, teachers will tell you with each and every drawing what's wrong with it to the minutest detail. But that's because the primary goal of art school is to improve. The CC is not, nor is any part of TCF. So once again, give criticism to those who ask for it, and them only. It's much better for everyone to give a lot of feedback to people who want it and none to people who do not than to give equal amounts to both parties.

    And finally, I have given and seen artist on this site get criticism very often. I've yet to meet one who rejected it.