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Crystal Assassin (Summoner) Revisited.

So I did some testing, trying out the concept of a pure Summoner Build in Master Mode & ran into some common issues. 🤔🥤
  1. Though there are amazing upgrades outside of Spider Gear/ Obsidian Armor, it wouldn't be "pure" (i.e. Forbidden Set).
  2. Most Mech Bosses will shred you with their Laser Attacks, Skeletron Prime being the least threatening of the three.
  3. Horizonal mobility isn't really the Spider Set's strength (Obsidian), which seems pretty important in these fights.
  4. Going for the DPS race with an alternate Set such as Obsidian Armor, isn't really much better, the Lasers become a bigger issue.
  5. The Maximum Effectiveness of Spider Minions & Queen Spider are all within "death range".
Seeing as how there are a number of reasonable solutions to this issue, but being a pure Summoner discourages them all, I still consider this to be a challenge run. Before sharing the main point of this post, I just wanna list some of the following, helpful solutions that might get mixed opinions.
  • Cross-Class assistance Weaponry (i.e. Nimbus Rod, Clinger Staff) N/A.
  • Cross-Class main Weaponry (i.e. Bows, Guns, Darts, Explosives) N/A.
  • Hybrid-Class sets with destructive synergy (i.e. Forbidden Set/ Mage Accessories) N/A.
Just to clarify, Spider Set vs. Mechs is a "winnable fight", it's just extremely unfavorable, which leads into the realm of masochism, more than it does a challenge run. For example, I consider each Mech Bosses' fight to be favorable toward the Boss against the Player at about these average ratios (all averages are based on legitimate battles, common methods of cheesing & exploits weren't considered).
  • Skeletron Prime vs. Spider Set (Master Mode), 60/40
  • Twins vs. Spider Set (Master Mode), 85/15
  • Destroyer vs. Spider Set (Master Mode), 95/5
Moving from Master Mode toward Master, ForTheWorthy makes these fights even worse, with the Destroyer fight being nearly "unwinnable", 99/1 (100-1) & Skeletron Prime's ratio jumping from 60/40 to about 80/20!
20210501143152_1.jpg


There is a reasonable solution to this issue but, it may just fall into the N/A (not allowed) category of this challenge run. I shouldn't be the authority on deciding; only because the common beliefs attached to pure Summoner, or the Class in its entirely aren't shared with myself & a larger portion of the community. Regardless, it should be presented & judged fairly, seeing as how it can be argued as a Class Neutral solution to a debatable problem.

Should the use of Crystal Assassin Armor be placed in the N/A category? I ask because at every difficulty level, the fight with Queen Slime is always favorable to the Player, about 95/5, which means RNG & grinding can be avoided (i.e. Forbidden Set), in addition to obtaining Blades Staff as a newer Minion. The fight seems so obvious, that I'd argue it's intentional, but removing my bias leads me to believe that Crystal Assassin Armor is still considered N/A.

For the sake of context, I have an example of how this Armor Set performs in the Summoner's least favorable Master Mode match-up, but it's up to you, the community to decided.
 

qwerty3.14

Terrarian
Ok so here's the thing.

Crystal assassin gives 15% damage and 15% crit, summonon can't crit wihich makes half of this armor's offense useless on a pure summon build, the extra slots and damage on spider or the insane whip bonuses of obsidian will more than compensate for the accesory slot assassin would have saved.

Secondly, it seems the minion you're using for fights is blade, which is fine, except for the fact that firecracker and coolwhip just do not synergise with blades whatsoever. Whips on their own have terrible base dps and are carried by thier tags (or obsidian armor) and you're mixing the wrong whip with the wrong minion. Until you can get durendel you should use spinal tap with blades, if you want to use firecracker you'll want a sanguine staff. Firecracker works well with spiders too but spiders struggle with fast air fights.

Coolwhip does not synergise with any minions and is often considered the worst whip in the game because of it, if you insist on using it then you should use obsidian armor.
 
Crystal assassin gives 15% damage and 15% crit, summonon can't crit wihich makes half of this armor's offense useless on a pure summon build, the extra slots and damage on spider or the insane whip bonuses of obsidian will more than compensate for the accesory slot assassin would have saved.
So I'll consider you the expert on the matter for the time being, my way of thinking as far as using Crystal Assassin Set is the universal DPS, which would include my own bias picks of Nimbus Rod & Clinger Staff.
  • 15% universal DPS + 15% Minion DMG w/ S. Emblem (30%)
    • Blades + Queen Spider + any Whip
  • 15% universal DPS + 20% Magic DMG w/ Magic Power Pots (35%)
    • Nimbus Clouds + Clinger Wall
    • +15% universal crit DMG + Crystal Ball buff
  • Free Accessory Slot for Dash + any Accessory (+Minion maybe??)
My focus wasn't necessarily being "optimal", but showcasing how a Summoner Class should be played at this stage considering the circumstance. Aside from any arbitrary rules, this is insane synergy for all things Summoner IMHO, I guess my goal was for a purist to explain to me why this kind of natural choice isn't desirable. 🤔🥤

Secondly, it seems the minion you're using for fights is blade, which is fine, except for the fact that firecracker and coolwhip just do not synergise with blades whatsoever. Whips on their own have terrible base dps and are carried by thier tags (or obsidian armor) and you're mixing the wrong whip with the wrong minion. Until you can get durendel you should use spinal tap with blades, if you want to use firecracker you'll want a sanguine staff. Firecracker works well with spiders too but spiders struggle with fast air fights.
Here's my thinking, taking progression into account. When fighting Destroyer, namely on Master Mode+, my main concern would be survivability & ease-of-use. The build I was using earlier accomplishes quite a number of things at once, DPS stacking aside.
  1. Cool Whip deals with Probes & adds extremely well.
  2. Blades also deals with Probes & adds extremely well.
  3. It's not necessary to engage Destroyer to defeat him, just do consistent DPS.
  4. The universal DPS from Assassins' Set allow Clinger & Nimbus to shred.
The synergy I was going for lies outside of a "neat lil' package", but if you're suggesting that pure Spider/ Obsidian is still the better choice, I'd like some insight. Also, I'm still not sure if the use of Mage Weapons such as Clinger & Nimbus are even allowed; & if they are, I'm convinced that Crystal Assassin outperforms both in almost every way.

You'd have to tell me the general consensus on that, because I'm still not sure about it.


Coolwhip does not synergise with any minions and is often considered the worst whip in the game because of it, if you insist on using it then you should use obsidian armor.
In what capacity? Do you mean for progressions' sake or in the Destroyer fight specifically? Could you show me an example of what it is you're describing, because I'm not very good at making sense of the current state of pure Summoner (what's allowed & what isn't??), I don't have many examples to draw from honestly... 😒🤷‍♂️
 

Dreadnautilus5000

Brain of Cthulhu
In what capacity? Do you mean for progressions' sake or in the Destroyer fight specifically? Could you show me an example of what it is you're describing, because I'm not very good at making sense of the current state of pure Summoner (what's allowed & what isn't??), I don't have many examples to draw from honestly... 😒🤷‍♂️
Every other whip has an effect that either boosts minions (Snapthorn, Spinal Tap, Durendal, Morning Star and Kaleidoscope) or triggers special effects when minions hit tagged enemies (Firecracker and Dark Harvest). Cool Whip summons a snowflake when the whip hits an enemy, rather than when a minion hits an enemy tagged by the whip. The snowflake doesn’t boost minions in any way either.

Also, pure summoner simply means that you can only use weapons that deal summon damage.
 

qwerty3.14

Terrarian
So I did some testing, trying out the concept of a pure Summoner Build in Master Mode & ran into some common issues.
It seemed like you were struggling so I was trying to help...

So I'll consider you the expert on the matter for the time being, my way of thinking as far as using Crystal Assassin Set is the universal DPS, which would include my own bias picks of Nimbus Rod & Clinger Staff.
  • 15% universal DPS + 15% Minion DMG w/ S. Emblem (30%)
    • Blades + Queen Spider + any Whip
  • 15% universal DPS + 20% Magic DMG w/ Magic Power Pots (35%)
    • Nimbus Clouds + Clinger Wall
    • +15% universal crit DMG + Crystal Ball buff
  • Free Accessory Slot for Dash + any Accessory (+Minion maybe??)
My focus wasn't necessarily being "optimal", but showcasing how a Summoner Class should be played at this stage considering the circumstance. Aside from any arbitrary rules, this is insane synergy for all things Summoner IMHO, I guess my goal was for a purist to explain to me why this kind of natural choice isn't desirable. 🤔🥤

Crystal assassin is not a bad set but this isn't really the situation it was built for, If your primary weapon did crits and had good damage this would be a fine build.

Like this is how bad whips' dps on thier own is. These are base dps.
Spinal tap: 58dps
Firecracker: 80dps
cool whip: 100dps

Compare this to life drain a weapon known for having poor single target dps.
Life drain: 175dps

And of course whips have a severe damage dropoff unlike life drain which has none, this isn't to say whips are bad but they are carried by their tags... and you are not taking advantage of those tags.

If you want 'pure summoner with magic support weapons too' I'd recommend you try forbidden, it gives more summon damage, more minions, almost as good as assassin for magic dps and you get a huge dust devil to summon.


Here's my thinking, taking progression into account. When fighting Destroyer, namely on Master Mode+, my main concern would be survivability & ease-of-use. The build I was using earlier accomplishes quite a number of things at once, DPS stacking aside.
  1. Cool Whip deals with Probes & adds extremely well.
  2. Blades also deals with Probes & adds extremely well.
  3. It's not necessary to engage Destroyer to defeat him, just do consistent DPS.
  4. The universal DPS from Assassins' Set allow Clinger & Nimbus to shred.

look at those dps numbers above... you know how I said whips are carried by thier tags...
firecracker multiplies the next minion attack's damage by 2.75x, this effectively adds 1.75x your minion's damage to the firecracker's base damage substantially increasing its damage output... unless you're using blades since those have very little base damage.

Spinal tap effectively doubles the damage output of your blade minions.

And what does cool whip do... it summons a slow moving snowflake that does about 10 damage, it doesn't even synergise with anything. Like literally a melee weapon synergises with your minions better because of sharpened.


The synergy I was going for lies outside of a "neat lil' package", but if you're suggesting that pure Spider/ Obsidian is still the better choice, I'd like some insight. Also, I'm still not sure if the use of Mage Weapons such as Clinger & Nimbus are even allowed; & if they are, I'm convinced that Crystal Assassin outperforms both in almost every way.

Not sure what you mean by 'against the rules' you set your own rules. Are you breaking you breaking your own rules?

I wouldn't be suprised if the nimubs rod was doing more damage against the destroyer than your summoing... considering the summon weapons you chose to use. Nimbus rod is know for being a very good weapon against destroyer.
 
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Maza

The Destroyer
I think the only thing that makes the fight you showed in particular "unpure" woluld be the use of Clinger Staff and Nimbus Rod, more so with the universal damage boost from the Crystal Assasin set, so I guess that as long as all your damage comes from summon damage sources any armor is ok.
Also, not that related but maybe, do Prime's bombs destroy dungeon bricks in For the Worthy?
 

Mail

Official Terrarian
... Also, not that related but maybe, do Prime's bombs destroy dungeon bricks in For the Worthy?
Dungeon bricks are not destroyed by for the worthy Skeletron Prime explosives. I built a large single tile wide dungeon brick box to contain his bombs, but needed to leave an air gap around it. The explosions were able to destroy blocks outside of the dungeon brick box that were within the explosion radius even when there was an explosion-proof block in between the explosion and the destroyed block.
 

Shyguymask

Terrarian
To be fair Cool Whip has one use. Being a substitute for Durendal for a Blade Staff user Pre-mech. After you've already strike with Spinal Tap & Snapthorn, you can switch to Cool Whip and take advantage of its higher base damage & snowflake minion for a bit of extra DPS overall. That's about it though.
 
Every other whip has an effect that either boosts minions (Snapthorn, Spinal Tap, Durendal, Morning Star and Kaleidoscope) or triggers special effects when minions hit tagged enemies (Firecracker and Dark Harvest). Cool Whip summons a snowflake when the whip hits an enemy, rather than when a minion hits an enemy tagged by the whip. The snowflake doesn’t boost minions in any way either.
Okay, I think I'm starting to see what you all mean... the goal is to boost the DPS of your Minions in particular, because any damage done without this effect is like leaving DMG potential on the table. 🤔🥤

Also, pure summoner simply means that you can only use weapons that deal summon damage.
Okay, so that clears things up for me. So, as long as you are doing summon or Minion DMG, it's considered pure?? Anything that boosts it such as Avengers Emblem or something like Celestial Shell are considered neutral; so Crystal Assassin Set is fine to use?

It seemed like you were struggling so I was trying to help...
Well... yes & no. Normally when a Terrarian runs into a problem, asking for help, I'm hesitant to give any advice, especially about Summoner strategies, because I'm still learning the "rules". I think I get it now though, so long as the person is dealing summon or Minion DMG, it's still considered pure, I consider Crystal Assassin to be like wearing an Destroyer Emblem + Tabi for free, both which are just Accessories & don't "get in the way".

I wanted to see the general consensus on the idea first before suggesting it as a viable solution.

Crystal assassin is not a bad set but this isn't really the situation it was built for, If your primary weapon did crits and had good damage this would be a fine build.
Got it, but I was looking at things from a progression perspective. For example, someone who was stuck on Master Mode, Old One's Army had critiqued the Event as being "poorly balanced" & "unfair". I suggested one of the DD2 Sets, to off-set the difficulty increase, but they pushed back because they were afraid it wasn't "pure". This has been a pretty common ideology that I'm still trying to understand, so I figured I'd ask the source.

Like this is how bad whips' dps on thier own is. These are base dps.
Spinal tap: 58dps
Firecracker: 80dps
cool whip: 100dps
🤔🥤

Compare this to life drain a weapon known for having poor single target dps.
Life drain: 175dps
Well, I'm a means to an end kinda thinker, but I'm starting to see your point. If Cool Whip is lower than the lowest possible DPS Melee Weapon in Hardmode, than it's objectively pretty bad. It's still pretty effective IMHO, but I guess that's beside the point if a person is planning to run Minions.

And of course whips have a severe damage dropoff unlike life drain which has none, this isn't to say whips are bad but they are carried by their tags... and you are not taking advantage of those tags.
🤔🥤

If you want 'pure summoner with magic support weapons too' I'd recommend you try forbidden, it gives more summon damage, more minions, almost as good as assassin for magic dps and you get a huge dust devil to summon.
Well, to come clean... I was shooting for an anti RNG solution, to the common complaint about Forbidden Armor. I guess I was trying to show that Crystal Assassin Set is arguably just as good, if not better; at least if the goal is just to get over the Mech Boss hump, of which the Player can just switch to Hallowed almost immediately. 🤔🥤

look at those dps numbers above... you know how I said whips are carried by thier tags...
firecracker multiplies the next minion attack's damage by 2.75x, this effectively adds 1.75x your minion's damage to the firecracker's base damage substantially increasing its damage output... unless you're using blades since those have very little base damage.
So if you were suggesting a strategy, do you go by the DPS numbers, or the moment-to-moment circumstances involved? Like for example, I'd suggest Cool Whip for the Destroyer fight almost every time, even though it's agreed to be one of the worst in the game, simply because of how it deals with Probes. Would you say in this scenario, that Spinal Tap is the better choice?

And what does cool whip do... it summons a slow moving snowflake that does about 10 damage, it doesn't even synergise with anything. Like literally a melee weapon synergises with your minions better because of sharpened.
🤔🥤

Not sure what you mean by 'against the rules' you set your own rules. Are you breaking you breaking your own rules?
Well, I personally don't have any "rules" unless I'm doing a challenge run, but it seems often, most Players have internal "rules" that I figured most would understand, from what I've observed since being a member of the forums. I wasn't sure exactly what they were & since you all are on the same page in many instances, I figured your answers would shed some light on what those rules were, but I think I've got it down now.

I wanna make the effort of being helpful, without being nearly as disruptive. Now that I know what "pure" means, I think I can do that more effectively now.

I wouldn't be suprised if the nimubs rod was doing more damage against the destroyer than your summoing... considering the summon weapons you chose to use. Nimbus rod is know for being a very good weapon against destroyer.
I guess it didn't really matter to me, the goal was to increase the winning ration against the Destroyer, which leads to Hallowed Bars. I just didn't see this match-up improving going from Master Mode to Master, ForTheWorthy, but I think I answered the overall question, which was my original intent.

My conclusion is... Crystal Assassin Set is indeed a viable option for pure Summoner runs in Master, ForTheWorthy, just stay away from Nimbus & Clinger Staff.
---

Updated 05/02/2021: I tried my very best, from as many angles as I could think, to use Spinal Tap against the Destroyer or its Probes & Cool Whip just out-performs it in every, single, way. I'm not sure if I'm doing something wrong, I also don't use Whip stacking as part of my normal strategy. If using this Whip is still, somehow better, could someone show me an example? 🤔🥤
20210502045951_1.jpg


Also, I think it's a bit odd to still be having trouble with Destroyer at this Armor tier, so on a personal note, I can't agree with choosing not to use Nimbus Rod & Clinger Staff in this fight. I was doing my best to meet the purist community halfway, but until I see otherwise, refusing to use these Weapons doesn't make any sense to me. 😒🤷‍♂️
---

Update: I made one final attempt with the Obsidian Armor, but it only made sense with using Blade Staff in concert with Nimbus & Clinger Staff (but that means Queen Slime is defeated so [PC]...). I replaced Pygmy Necklace with Shield of Cthulhu, & stuck with Cool Whip, so the build felt pretty similar, though I'm sure I don't need to state that Crystal Assassin was still the superior choice. From a progression standpoint, I don't think it makes much sense to stick with Obsidian Armor, once you have access to Crystal Assassin Set, but that's just my personal opinion.
 
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whoneedsnamestbh

Eater of Worlds
I consider Crystal Assassin to be like wearing an Destroyer Emblem + Tabi for free, both which are just Accessories & don't "get in the way".
The thing to consider is that you also drop the benefits of any other armor for this dash + destroyer emblem. 15% damage and crit is hardly unique to this set itself, and to free up an accessory slot for dash you sacrifice a little bit of offense and a set bonus. Because this extra slot still has potential for 19% damage, I still consider Crystal Assassin strong, but I don’t think this is a good way to look at it. All accessories and armors have an opportunity cost to using them.

Okay, so that clears things up for me. So, as long as you are doing summon or Minion DMG, it's considered pure?? Anything that boosts it such as Avengers Emblem or something like Celestial Shell are considered neutral; so Crystal Assassin Set is fine to use?
Yep, and also things like Shield of Cthulhu. Shield of Cthulhu is considered a mobility tool even if it deals melee damage and is free to use in most pure playthroughs unless specified otherwise - I think you’re making the mechs too hard on yourself by avoiding it and relying on Crystal Assassin for dash.

So if you were suggesting a strategy, do you go by the DPS numbers, or the moment-to-moment circumstances involved? Like for example, I'd suggest Cool Whip for the Destroyer fight almost every time, even though it's agreed to be one of the worst in the game, simply because of how it deals with Probes. Would you say in this scenario, that Spinal Tap is the better choice?
Updated 05/02/2021: I tried my very best, from as many angles as I could think, to use Spinal Tap against the Destroyer or its Probes & Cool Whip just out-performs it in every, single, way. I'm not sure if I'm doing something wrong, I also don't use Whip stacking as part of my normal strategy. If using this Whip is still, somehow better, could someone show me an example? 🤔🥤
Cool Whip is still the worst whip for most situations - minions with 7 extra damage on Spinal Tap hit much more often than the snowflake that hits for 10, and the Firecracker’s explosions easily outDPS the snowflake with any minion except Blades (where you’d use Spinal Tap anyway).

But I won’t deny that it’s probably the best pre-Durendal whip for Destroyer, *after* he uncoils. Tags on the Destroyer usually do jack :red: because the Destroyer moves and brings the tags with him, and because Destroyer is a worm, the snowflake glides along his body and does more damage than it usually does.

I want to elaborate that outside of this specific fight and maybe Wyverns, Cool Whip’s niche is usually considered moot. Again, the snowflake can hit for 10 damage at a *max* 6 times per second (but good luck reaching this, the snowflake is awfully stupid). For Blades which hit several dozen times per second, the 7 extra damage on Spinal Tap not only adds more overall but is also more consistent. With Spiders and Sanguines and any summon damage, you can assume a low end of 60 damage per Firecracker explosion - which still grossly beats out Cool Whip. Cool Whip’s own base damage isn’t enough to bridge this gap, and Frostburn adds nothing except for pretty colors. As for a crowd weapon, you’re better off buffing Blades with their linear slicing, and its wall pierce can be replaced by simply recasting Spider.

Update: I made one final attempt with the Obsidian Armor, but it only made sense with using Blade Staff in concert with Nimbus & Clinger Staff (but that means Queen Slime is defeated so [PC]...). I replaced Pygmy Necklace with Shield of Cthulhu, & stuck with Cool Whip, so the build felt pretty similar, though I'm sure I don't need to state that Crystal Assassin was still the superior choice. From a progression standpoint, I don't think it makes much sense to stick with Obsidian Armor, once you have access to Crystal Assassin Set, but that's just my personal opinion.
Sorry, I can’t possibly agree with this.
The material benefits Obsidian has over Crystal Assassin are 15% damage, an extra minion, *and* 50% whip range and 33% whip speed. The one extra accessory slot freed up by using Crystal Assassin instead of Shield of Cthulhu for dash cannot possibly fill up all of these benefits.

Crystal Assassin is a set designed for melee, ranged and mage, it’s really not got much of a role as summoner tbh. Summoners rely strongly on the damage and extra minions, and Crystal Assassin offers lower damage than any other summon armor except Flinx and no extra minions, nor does it offer the benefits of Obsidian’s set bonus.
 

Coleyohley

Terrarian
I don’t think this is a good way to look at it. All accessories and armors have an opportunity cost to using them.
I agree with all of your post except this part (unless I'm grossly misunderstanding). Crystal Assassin removes the opportunity cost of one accessory by giving you a dash. I would assume that the vast majority of players would have been using a dash anyway, so Crystal Assassin allows you to have that dash for free, and equipping a damage accessory in the free slot will more than make up for the armor's subpar base stats. The opportunity cost essentially comes down to not really having access to a unique Set Bonus, with the benefits of the armor being that of Omni-damage and more mobility (at least Pre-Plantera.)

Edit: Thought about it for a bit and I realized the set technically DOES have a Unique Set Bonus: Increased Dash length.

The free accessory slot is cool and all, but I think it's better to view any damage/defense items you put there as a stat boost from the armor set rather than as part of the set bonus. If you were to fill the empty slot with say, a Putrid Scent, the armor set would give you 20% Damage and 20% Crit. Other high-stat armors, such as Hallowed or Adamantite, can reach similar stat spreads, but what those armors can't offer you is the increased dash length.
 
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Dreadnautilus5000

Brain of Cthulhu
I agree with all of your post except this part (unless I'm grossly misunderstanding). Crystal Assassin removes the oppotunity cost of one accessory by giving you a dash. I would assume that the vast majority of players would have been using a dash anyway, so Crystal Assassin allows you to have that dash for free, while equipping an extra damage accessory will more than make up for the armor's subpar base stats. The opportunity cost essentially comes down to not having access to the other Set Bonuses, with the benefits of the armor being that of Omni-damage and more mobility (at least Pre-Plantera.)
In the case of pure summoner, there aren’t any single accessories that increase minion slots by 3 like Spider armour does or increase whip range by 50% and whip speed by 35% like Obsidian armour does.

If there was, then Crystal Assassin armour would probably be the best early Hardmode armour for summoners.
 

Coleyohley

Terrarian
In the case of pure summoner, there aren’t any single accessories that increase minion slots by 3 like Spider armour does or increase whip range by 50% and whip speed by 35% like Obsidian armour does.

If there was, then Crystal Assassin armour would probably be the best early Hardmode armour for summoners.
I agree with that. Crystal Assassin is almost certainly not a Summoner set. It will boost any side minions you happen to have but using it is a bad idea if minions are your main source of damage.
 
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Okay, so it's settled then! If by some manner the Mechs seem impossible to deal with due to stat increase, Crystal Assassin Set is ok to substitute until you gain access to Hallowed Bars. 🤔🥤

This should cover several common issues.
  • If Sandstorm RNG isn't on your side, just kill Queen Slime.
  • If Dreadnautilus can't be cheesed because of stat bloat, just kill Queen Slime.
  • & lastly if you're MLG enough, the dash from this set should allow you to fight Duke earlier than usual.
I'm sure there's more stuff, but these are decent enough reasons for me.
 

whoneedsnamestbh

Eater of Worlds
Okay, so it's settled then! If by some manner the Mechs seem impossible to deal with due to stat increase, Crystal Assassin Set is ok to substitute until you gain access to Hallowed Bars. 🤔🥤

This should cover several common issues.
  • If Sandstorm RNG isn't on your side, just kill Queen Slime.
  • If Dreadnautilus can't be cheesed because of stat bloat, just kill Queen Slime.
  • & lastly if you're MLG enough, the dash from this set should allow you to fight Duke earlier than usual.
I'm sure there's more stuff, but these are decent enough reasons for me.
I... don’t think that’s what anyone was saying. To sum it up, Crystal Assassin is a capable set for *melee, mage, and ranged* due to the extra dash length and free accessory; but for Summoner, the extra accessory slot it frees up by replacing Shield of Cthulhu’s dash doesn’t make up for Obsidian’s 16% extra damage, 30% whip range, 50% whip speed and 1 extra minion - or Spider’s 13% extra damage and 3 extra minions. There’s simply not an accessory to replace the Shield of Cthulhu that can make Crystal Assassin better than the alternatives for Summoner, unless you are hybriding and your major focus is on the other three classes.
 
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I... don’t think that’s what anyone was saying. To sum it up, Crystal Assassin is a capable set for *melee, mage, and ranged* due to the extra dash length and free accessory; but for Summoner, the extra accessory slot it frees up by replacing Shield of Cthulhu’s dash doesn’t make up for Obsidian’s 16% extra damage, 30% whip range, 50% whip speed and 1 extra minion - or Spider’s 13% extra damage and 3 extra minions. There’s simply not an accessory to replace the Shield of Cthulhu that can make Crystal Assassin better than the alternatives for Summoner, unless you are hybriding and your major focus is on the other three classes.
Ok, I think I got it now. So, what's the general consensus when it comes to the Mech Bosses verse a pure Summoner? I ask, only because Master, ForTheWorthy changes things pretty drastically I think. For example, in Master Mode I'd normally do this:
  • Go for Forbidden Set if possible, but if Fishing, Mining & Weather RNG are all bad...
  • Kill Skeletron Prime, as I consider him to be the easiest Mech Boss (no cheese).
  • Kill Twins for Minions, or Queen Slime for Minions + Mount.
The problem, at least for me, arises with Skeletron Prime FTW. As I said earlier, the normal Arena doesn't work here & because it's much more difficult to ensure consistent DPS, you now run the risk of losing the fight because of Daybreak (insta-kill). What's the recommended strategy here, since Clinger Staff & Nimbus Rod aren't allowed against Destroyer FTW? 🤔🥤


But with Crystal Assassin armour, you can't dash into enemies to get invincibility frames, and that effect is useful during the Fishron fight because if you can time your dashes right you can completely avoid damage by dashing into the Duke.
Well, I'll do some testing but, the dash from Assassin's Set seems swift enough & cover the distance needed to evade being hit entirely. I'm just assuming it'll work, only because it seems about 2.5 times the distance of standard dash; let's see how it actually functions in practice though. 😏🤷‍♂️
 

whoneedsnamestbh

Eater of Worlds
Ok, I think I got it now. So, what's the general consensus when it comes to the Mech Bosses verse a pure Summoner? I ask, only because Master, ForTheWorthy changes things pretty drastically I think. For example, in Master Mode I'd normally do this:
  • Go for Forbidden Set if possible, but if Fishing, Mining & Weather RNG are all bad...
  • Kill Skeletron Prime, as I consider him to be the easiest Mech Boss (no cheese).
  • Kill Twins for Minions, or Queen Slime for Minions + Mount.
The problem, at least for me, arises with Skeletron Prime FTW. As I said earlier, the normal Arena doesn't work here & because it's much more difficult to ensure consistent DPS, you now run the risk of losing the fight because of Daybreak (insta-kill). What's the recommended strategy here, since Clinger Staff & Nimbus Rod aren't allowed against Destroyer FTW? 🤔🥤
Well, usually for these bosses you’d use Obsidian Armor or Spider Armor. For a pure summoner, these offer the best for summoner in each of these roles, and for mobility you’d have a shield of cthulhu - its dash is effective enough for the mechs.

You’d use either Spider, Blades and Spinal Tap or Obsidian, Sanguine and Firecracker for the first mech, and the immedtaely after upgrade to Durendal. For Destroyer, it’s a bit different: Cool Whip, and Forbidden for the tornado. You also *absolutely* want Ichor Flasks.

If you’re having a hard time killing Prime fast enough, I’d start with Twins, tbh. As long as you fall back and stop whipping when Spazmatism in second phase does his flamethrower attack, you should be fine. If you’re having trouble with range, use Obsidian over Spider with blades. Then you can upgrade to Durendal and have a much easier time dealing substantial DPS to Prime, especially if you *stack spinal tap and durendal*. For Destroyer, use cool whip (only boss it’s effective at) and Forbidden Armor to optimize DPS. Strike with cool whip to spawn the snowflake and then use durendal’s superior DPS until the snowflake despawns.
 
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Maza

The Destroyer
The problem, at least for me, arises with Skeletron Prime FTW. As I said earlier, the normal Arena doesn't work here & because it's much more difficult to ensure consistent DPS, you now run the risk of losing the fight because of Daybreak (insta-kill).
Dungeon bricks are not destroyed by for the worthy Skeletron Prime explosives.
I think the answer here is a Dungeon brick skybridge, at least for Skeletron Prime, and combined with your Crystal Assassin set strategy might be enough to turn the tides on subsequent mech-boss battles.
 

Coleyohley

Terrarian
I think the answer here is a Dungeon brick skybridge, at least for Skeletron Prime, and combined with your Crystal Assassin set strategy might be enough to turn the tides on subsequent mech-boss battles.
Actually, you can fight him just like you would in every other mode if you simply place chests on your platforms. The bombs cannot blow up tiles holding a chest (even if it’s empty), so you can space them out and fight him like normal.

192F91B1-04A7-4242-910F-CB1C80A8DFC8.png






















(I used Dressers in the pic because they covered more space, so I thought they would more efficient. They were not.)

Now while that might sound incredibly resource-heavy, remember that Ore Veins are double-sized in FTW, and mining is incredibly fast thanks to the flimsy blocks. It only took me about 5 minutes of mining to get the iron needed for over 100 chests, which was more than enough to cover my arena.
 
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