tModLoader Experience and Classes

Are the new class advancement requirements reasonable?

  • Yes! Major changes are NOT needed.

    Votes: 19 76.0%
  • The Monster/Boss Orb requirements are reasonable, but not the other requirements.

    Votes: 1 4.0%
  • The other requirements are reasonable, but not the Monster/Boss Orb requirements.

    Votes: 5 20.0%
  • No! Major changes are needed.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    25
  • Poll closed .
Hi! So I really like this mod, but I had an idea about how Ninja can keep its power but not rule the Class lineup. Because, right now, between the dps, the mobility, and the dodge, Ninja kind of dominates.

It seems to me that a lot of other classes should have basic, innate abilities that also address their quality of life. For instance: mobility. Wizards are wizards! They should eventually be able to do stuff like the Flying Carpet float, fly, or even short teleports a la Rod of Discord! The rangers should at least be able to double-jump at a certain point, and maybe go camo, like Thorium's Nova Rifle... maybe the archer's camo is a hide-and-recover self-healing effect and the gunner's is a "sniper-style" damage effect.

I REALLY like this mod, though! I use Cheat Sheet for an extra "class-only" accessory slot, and I've been trying out a bunch of the classes in combination with other mods (like Thorium's Healer with E&C's Saint... a bit slow on the damage output until very late, but tough as nails for scythe rushes) while soloing. I'd definitely like to see more!
 
Okay, it's been fun and all, but I really feel like I should point out... the Saint's damage aura insta-kills the Moon Lord's True Eyes of Cthulhu. The poor guy just hovers there and lets me kill him, holding his tattered hands up like "NOOOOO!!!"
 
Is there any way i can disable the -1% minion damage per bonus minion? I want extra minons but i dont want lose my damage
 
On high level (lv 187), I noticed that lass token ninja's tooltip says "+0% dodge". Is it really 0% or a display error?
 
I really wish the hybrid token would be ... somewhat better. Like, compared to ninja, mystic, or the other's, hybrid seems to be all over the place, with random bonus amounts. Like, whats with the 40% melee damage by level 100, but magic/ranged/summons 50%, and throwing 75%?!!?! Would 50% all / 0.5% per level progression have been to weird? And why doesn't magic get the 7% cap on crit in the hybrid, when melee/ranged/throw does? Right now, the best thing to go for hybrid II is Throwing/Summoner; anything else would be a waste.

Even if you play as a hybrid character (which, 90% of the time is going to be melee/ranged/magic with hybrid summoner, due to the DD2 content), your still doing less damage then a "purist" class because you cant utilize -all of your damage types- simultaneously, obviously. Like, whats scarier at level 100? +150% Magic damage, +10% Magic Crit? Or +50% Magic Damage and +50% Summon Damage, with no crit at all? Considering spells like last prism, blizzard, or modded ones like light's lament/true light's lament, bloodboil, or crazy stuff like calamity's endgame+ content. Yeah, hybrid gets a little more hp, but, it needs a tad bit of damage love. Just a little.

I would love to see something more like;

Hybrid II (Tier 3) (Accessory)

Scaling Bonuses;
+1 Health
+0.075 Health Regen
+1 Mana (Cannot Exceed 400 Total)
+0.1 Mana Regen Delay Bonus (Max 10)
+0.05 Defense
+5% Jump Speed (Max 150%)
+1.5 Move Speed (Max 150)
+0.75% Melee Damage
+0.15% Melee Crit (Max 7%)
+0.75% Throw Damage
+0.15% Throw Crit (Max 7%)
+0.75% Ranged Damage
+0.15% Ranged Crit (Max 7%)
+0.75% Magic Damage
+0.15% Magic Crit (Max 7%)
-0.7% Mana Used (Max -35%)
+0.75% Minion Damage
+0.075 Max Minions (Max 5)

Unlocked Bonuses;
Level 10: Immune to Slow
Level 20: 20% Less Ammo Used.
Level 30: Immune to Silence
Level 40: 25% Less Ammo Used
Level 50: Immune to Fall Damage
Level 60: Immune to Curse
Level 80: Immune to Knockback

Reasonings;

Damage Rates: So hear me out - if people are using mods, they usually have more then one. If they are using any off the mod browser - then chances are, they have Calamity, Thorium, Tremor, Zoaklen, or even Spirit Mod, in which case, have plenty of throwing weapons. I swear to god, I got 3 different kinds of throwing emblems (ninjas, throwing, you name it). There is end-game "Stellar Armor" for throwing, entire new sets, you name it. Throwing is not the bastardchild forlorn build anymore; its gotten its fair share of love now. That aside: its damage progression was the only one worth using for a hybrid, and melee, etc, shouldn't be punished. So a buff to the other damage types to match with throwing's progression at 0.75% per level isn't unreasonable. I mean, at most, your usually utilizing 2 damage types simultaneously; any one + minion damage. If both damage types are 0.75% progression, your coming about even to a focused class (like mystic's) +1.5% progression. Not quite however, due to the lower crit chance and minions not critting, but, thats the price you pay for splitting damage.

Mana Regen Delay Bonus: Less then half of what mystic gets, but, its a big deal if your a hybrid utilizing magic often.

Mana Cost Reduction + Less Ammo Used: Assuming that you go ranged in your build at all, why shouldn't ammo cost's be reduced like the mana cost reduction?

Crit-R-Done: Magic loves its crit's to. Make it more even progression for them all and toss mage that partial crit chance, please!

Midas Be Gone: I felt like midas on hit is something rogue/thief's should get, you know? Toss dat stuff for rogue-exclusiveness. Let them be the cash cow's. Added Slow Immunity at level 10 (to benefit melee-based hybrid's more, and to utilize with the boost in move/jump speed better) instead of midas scaling.

Would you ever consider this senpai? q-q I love this mod but, hybrid needs to be equalized between the damage types! My ocd demands it! Halp plz.

Ps: Absolutely love chocobo mod and zelda rupee's. Any chance of ever making a music box that plays the chocobo theme song? > _ >
 
I really wish the hybrid token would be ... somewhat better. Like, compared to ninja, mystic, or the other's, hybrid seems to be all over the place, with random bonus amounts. Like, whats with the 40% melee damage by level 100, but magic/ranged/summons 50%, and throwing 75%?!!?! Would 50% all / 0.5% per level progression have been to weird? And why doesn't magic get the 7% cap on crit in the hybrid, when melee/ranged/throw does? Right now, the best thing to go for hybrid II is Throwing/Summoner; anything else would be a waste.

snip
Actually, Hybrid is something of a problem in class progression because it's very powerful; "livable" bonuses for all class types and a LOT of quality-of-life (QoL) bonuses like move speed, jump speed, health, health regen, mana, and defense. If you're wondering about the difference in bonus amounts, it's because throwing gets little support in vanilla, and melee in vanilla is VASTLY overpowered... "melee" impinges heavily on the other classes with projectiles/long range attacks, and area-of-effect/piercing effects, while ALSO getting its class bonuses from the equipment with the highest defense and life bonuses to boot. Damage, range, crowd control, versatility, survivability... melee is just overpowered. So... melee doesn't need big bonuses.

Personally, I go hybrid til I'm past 25 regardless of class, because the damage bonuses are always "good enough" and the QoL bonuses are superior to everything else. Even after, I'm likely to go Rogue for the QoL bonuses (Terraria is heavily balanced for mobility), because most other classes are extremely limited. You give up a LOT of QoL to choose most of them.
 
"Actually, Hybrid is something of a problem in class progression because it's very powerful; "livable" bonuses for all class types and a LOT of quality-of-life (QoL) bonuses like move speed, jump speed, health, health regen, mana, and defense."

Your also failing to take into account Hybrid -cannot utilize all of those stats simultaneously-. You can only do 2 damage types at the same time. And, if you use minions, enemies have hit frames, and your minions will be doing most boss damage while your other attacks do nothing or only hit occasionally, which eats even further into your dps. Ranged doesnt get less ammo consumed, magic gets no crit, so on. Overall: Out of the 2 damage types, minion damage will be most of it, so your 2nd type is kinda "meh" anyway. All I want is for hybrid to do the same dps as other builds when using 2 seperate damage types, as a purist does utilizing 1. Thats not to much to ask for.

Also, the defense bonus is laughable at best, the mana is only used if your a magic user, but you get less mana cost reduction and no crit chance and less damage, so your burning out faster then a mage/mystic anyway, so that bonus mana does not mean much.

If I wanted to go throwing/mobility/move/jump stuff, I would have went ninja. The dodge chance it gets is far better then the small bit of defense/hp scaling hybrid 2 gets, by far (especially when combined with master ninja gear/tabi, or a cross necklace).

"If you're wondering about the difference in bonus amounts, it's because throwing gets little support in vanilla, and melee in vanilla is VASTLY overpowered... "

This isn't vanilla. And anyone who has tmodloader, very likely, isn't vanilla. I doubt they install just this mod. There is, literally, over 10 mod's on the mod browser that help throwing. Some indirectly, some exist entirely for it. So don't use vanillas an excuse/reasoning; its a weak one to go by.

"I'm likely to go Rogue for the QoL bonuses (Terraria is heavily balanced for mobility), because most other classes are extremely limited. You give up a LOT of QoL to choose most of them."

Exactly: Rogue and Ninja is easily the strongest classes in this mod due to highest damage bonuses "AND" mobility, and even more bs, they arn't giving up anything, because mobility/dodge "IS" survivability, and they got high damage/crit chance, midas for wealth/reforging, etc. Like, why doesn't your melee classes get bonus mobility, or ranger? Why doesn't mage/mystics get immunity to the rod of discord debuff so it can teleport more often for its magic-themed mobility? Eh.

Summary: Rogue/Ninja needs nerf, Hybrid needs to be less throw-focused and more equal to all its aspects (ammo reduction for ranged, crit for magic, at the very least - or maybe an ability so enemies have less invulnerability frames/time do you can bring both damage types to bare to full effect), and some other classes need mobility options - beserker/ranger maybe more move speed/jump power, mage/mystic/etc immunity to the rod of discord debuff? -shrug-
 
Your also failing to take into account Hybrid -cannot utilize all of those stats simultaneously-. You can only do 2 damage types at the same time. And, if you use minions, enemies have hit frames, and your minions will be doing most boss damage while your other attacks do nothing or only hit occasionally, which eats even further into your dps. Ranged doesnt get less ammo consumed, magic gets no crit, so on. Overall: Out of the 2 damage types, minion damage will be most of it, so your 2nd type is kinda "meh" anyway. All I want is for hybrid to do the same dps as other builds when using 2 seperate damage types, as a purist does utilizing 1. Thats not to much to ask for.

Also, the defense bonus is laughable at best, the mana is only used if your a magic user, but you get less mana cost reduction and no crit chance and less damage, so your burning out faster then a mage/mystic anyway, so that bonus mana does not mean much.

If I wanted to go throwing/mobility/move/jump stuff, I would have went ninja. The dodge chance it gets is far better then the small bit of defense/hp scaling hybrid 2 gets, by far (especially when combined with master ninja gear/tabi, or a cross necklace).

This isn't vanilla. And anyone who has tmodloader, very likely, isn't vanilla. I doubt they install just this mod. There is, literally, over 10 mod's on the mod browser that help throwing. Some indirectly, some exist entirely for it. So don't use vanillas an excuse/reasoning; its a weak one to go by.

Exactly: Rogue and Ninja is easily the strongest classes in this mod due to highest damage bonuses "AND" mobility, and even more bs, they arn't giving up anything, because mobility/dodge "IS" survivability, and they got high damage/crit chance, midas for wealth/reforging, etc. Like, why doesn't your melee classes get bonus mobility, or ranger? Why doesn't mage/mystics get immunity to the rod of discord debuff so it can teleport more often for its magic-themed mobility? Eh.

Summary: Rogue/Ninja needs nerf, Hybrid needs to be less throw-focused and more equal to all its aspects (ammo reduction for ranged, crit for magic, at the very least - or maybe an ability so enemies have less invulnerability frames/time do you can bring both damage types to bare to full effect), and some other classes need mobility options - beserker/ranger maybe more move speed/jump power, mage/mystic/etc immunity to the rod of discord debuff? -shrug-

I never failed to take anything into account... no matter which damage bonuses you get from Hybrid, you're getting damage bonuses from Hybrid. They're not the best, but they're still decent. The trade-off for class-specific bonuses such as magic crit is higher survivability and mobility (which, in Terraria, mobility is more survivability). It's well-rounded, but intentionally not the best at anything... that's the point. if you want to specialize, be something other than hybrid.

I am not going to make arguments that gamble on imaginary people and their potential choice of mods to push my point or tear yours down. Every major mod breaks the game no matter what you play, so that's beside the point.

I agree Rogue and Ninja are possibly overpowered, if you go the melee/throwing route. Especially with those dodge bonuses. I addressed this before by pointing out that they provide important QoL bonuses, but many other classes don't; maybe they need to be scaled back, but other classes still need stylized QoL bonuses, because, otherwise, most of them are just "generic dps class" and you may as well play Rogue/Ninja. However, what I'm trying to avoid is insisting on Monty Haul game-destroying bonuses... these classes, even the poorly-balanced ones, already do plenty to unbalance the game in favor of the player, other mods or no mods. I don't think Hybrid needs class-specialized bonuses; those should stay with the specialized classes. It's kind of the point. And, mods or no mods, between projectile swords/scythes that circumvent walls and hit multiple times, yoyos, multi-boomerangs and more, I still think melee has a major edge over the other classes... especially since melee armor is also tough as nails.

And don't forget you can multi-class by equipping multiple tokens. Yes, you lose utility slots for other QoL gear, but these tokens... even at half or one-third strength... unbalance the game in your favor in significant ways. If you want more bonuses than hybrid provides and don't want to be pigeonholed into ONLY the bonuses of one specialized class, then try multi-classing. It's there as an option for a reason.
 
Has anyone else had problems with the Saint's damage aura breaking martian saucers?

Edit: It also instantly kills the Flying Dutchman. Seems to be an issue with multi-part enemies.

Edit 2: When the aura kills the cultists, it doesn't spawn the Lunatic cultist.

Edit 3: I think the root of all these problems is that the damage aura is hitting invincible enemies. It also damages the Lunar Pillars before the shield drops.
 
Last edited:
I play with this mod quite often when I'm not playing as any custom damage classes. I set a level cap of 100 which I usually hit by the time I start doing post Moon Lord bosses. It gives me additional rewards for killing. I can usually barely hit level 25 pre-hardmode. I think 50 Ascension Orbs might be a bit too much for tier III class advancement. At least being able to farm bosses to get Boss Orbs to transform into Ascension Orbs helps out.

I find throwing to be in an odd place with this mod. The Rogue class is the only tier II non hybrid class that has more than one damage bonus. Throwing doesn't get its own tier II class like the rest of the damage types do. As for the Ninja class, I feel the damage bonus is too high and the flower petal effect not needed. Modded throwing weapons are not by any means weak compared to other class weapons. Even the bonuses this class gets wouldn't get you very far at all if you try using vanilla throwing weapons in hardmode. It seems like it wasn't taken into consideration that people would use mods that add throwing weapons all throughout hardmode to stay competitive with the other classes. I think the damage bonus should be 1.5% per level and the flower petal removed. I'm not entirely sure, but it's possible the flower petal might trigger enemy immunity frames which could actually lower DPS if you're using fast and hard hitting throwing weapons. At least there is a command setting to adjust the damage bonus, although I don't think it's possible to remove the flower petal bonus.

It seems the Yoyo Attack Speed Workaround mod doesn't always quite work. On my latest melee playthrough, I chose the Berserker class. On top of accessories and violet modifiers for them, I probably have over 200% melee attack speed. On some yoyos, they work fine, but not on others. I don't know what specifically determines that. Maybe it's possible that they are not correctly restricted to 200% attack speed?
 
I'm guessing the reason the ninja is so powerful in this mod is because throwing in vanilla was not a fully fleshed out class.. at all. They were random items you'd pick up and use early game out of necessity, and then trash/sell for the rest of the game. I would never expect a mod maker to balance their mod around other mods. It just doesn't make any sense.

A reasonable request would be if the mod-maker could either provide an ini file along with the mod that players can use to customize the numbers to their liking, or create alternate versions of the mod balanced around major content mods. Would this be possible at all?

PS: The same argument works the other way around. THIS mod horribly unbalances the content in other mods like Thorium and Calamity, which were never designed around the player having access to such a horribly broken thing as the class token that is available in this mod. At very high levels, the combined effect of anything you could put in the other accessory slots would pale in comparison to the bonuses this mod would provide. Honestly.. the idea of balance should be shelved when you start talking about introducing infinite power creep, such as this mod.
 
Can you please consider putting together pre-hard mode boost to the healer? :) Healer is terribly struggling until post-game and I think it may need some survivability and a boost to healing that can be more viable throughout the game. The fact that cleric A lot of bosses tend to chew far more than a healer can heal while a healer is necessary to progress in my modpack.

Also feel like bow users and healers pale in comparison to the rest of the roster because none of the main game let alone popular mods provide proper items to them. I think it would be highly necessary to make a class for the cleric that is specifically for healing and less so much for support.

I don't play healer but the healer in my party has been having trouble throughout our three playthroughs all the way to the very end of Calamity. The only issues are pre-post game content and moreso pre-hard mode.
 
Can you please consider putting together pre-hard mode boost to the healer? :) Healer is terribly struggling until post-game and I think it may need some survivability and a boost to healing that can be more viable throughout the game. The fact that cleric A lot of bosses tend to chew far more than a healer can heal while a healer is necessary to progress in my modpack.

Also feel like bow users and healers pale in comparison to the rest of the roster because none of the main game let alone popular mods provide proper items to them. I think it would be highly necessary to make a class for the cleric that is specifically for healing and less so much for support.

I don't play healer but the healer in my party has been having trouble throughout our three playthroughs all the way to the very end of Calamity. The only issues are pre-post game content and moreso pre-hard mode.
Healer, specifically, is a Thorium class. Tokens from this mod can help them, somewhat... I'd suggest a Thief (for mobility), Hybrid (mobility and mana), or Mage (mana) token progression pre-hardmode... but the class itself belongs to that mod.
 
Hi im just played with some friends I thinks I have found a bug. Im playing warrior class but when I got 10 Lead I cant upgreade to tire 2. I then made a map with Iron and when I got 10 Iron bars I could make it but when I made it. I was using Lead to craft it
 
Can you please consider putting together pre-hard mode boost to the healer? :) Healer is terribly struggling until post-game and I think it may need some survivability and a boost to healing that can be more viable throughout the game. The fact that cleric A lot of bosses tend to chew far more than a healer can heal while a healer is necessary to progress in my modpack.

Also feel like bow users and healers pale in comparison to the rest of the roster because none of the main game let alone popular mods provide proper items to them. I think it would be highly necessary to make a class for the cleric that is specifically for healing and less so much for support.

I don't play healer but the healer in my party has been having trouble throughout our three playthroughs all the way to the very end of Calamity. The only issues are pre-post game content and moreso pre-hard mode.
What kind of boost did you have in mind? Is it a survivability issue or a damage issue?

Hi im just played with some friends I thinks I have found a bug. Im playing warrior class but when I got 10 Lead I cant upgreade to tire 2. I then made a map with Iron and when I got 10 Iron bars I could make it but when I made it. I was using Lead to craft it
I have just updated with a recompile under the latest tModLoader (I was a few subversions behind). This should fix most minor bugs, but please do let me know if it's still happening after the update.

is there a way for me to use multiple exp orbs at once or do i just have to click each one of them
There are recipes to craft the orbs into higher-value orbs (e.g., turn x100 orbs into one orb worth 100) to reduce clicking. At one point, there was a command to consume all orbs but I don't remember if it's still in there.
 
So.. currently having this "Problem" of everytime something dies it just displays "Failed to change the experience value for player #3(player not yet synced)"
How do i do this "Syncing"?
 
So.. currently having this "Problem" of everytime something dies it just displays "Failed to change the experience value for player #3(player not yet synced)"
How do i do this "Syncing"?
Sorry about that. I put out an update last night with a fix so just patch up.
 
Been trying to update from 1.2.8 to 1.3.1, but every time I open a world the game crashes. Going back to 1.2.8 makes things behave again.
 
Back
Top Bottom