ppowersteef
Paladin
Topical for version 1.3.5, this is no longer possible in 1.4
The Fetid Baghnakhs.
A weapon with a name that I can barely write well without making corrections.
Introduced since 1.3. And up untill today, it's known as the fastest melee weapon in the game.
Through some melee speed builds, it's discovered that this is capable to archieve a 'single-frame-swing'. Where the weapon moves so fast, that you'll only see one frame at a time.
This actually leads to interesting discoveries. As it does no longer damage-per-swing, but instead, damage-per-frame. This gives them the unique potential to deal the most DPS in the game!
So how can we optimise this?
That's what this thread is about.
I'm splitting this analysis up in 2 parts:
- One that researches the minimum Melee Speed required to reach the single frame.
- And a part about utilising it's DPS.
But first of all, what is this all about?
Part 1/2: Reducing the required Melee Speed to it's minimum.
There's one thing that's important for this build: Increasing the melee speed beyond the MaxFrame is no use.
Once you've reached the point of the single frame, then there will be no other visible changes afterwards. Even after maxing out the Melee Speed, the single frame stays the same.
So the idea of the build is to minimise the required Melee Speed to reach the MaxFrame. So after that, there's a flexibility available to improve the build by adding damage, or mobility.
There's however one problem...Melee Speed Calculations are weird.
It's not just about adding up 10 + 10. But It's first doing calculations of the first stat before going to the next.
So 100 +10% + 10% is not 120%, but rather 100 + 10% = 110, 110 + 10% = 121% (At least...that's what I think, I don't know the game's code that way)
So it looks like that the amount of equipment and amount of prefixes matters for a higher increase. which makes things difficult when you want to minimise it.
Here's a list of the used Melee Speed modifiers:
I want this build to be mostly consistent, which means no temporary buffs, and no specific criterias needed. Day/nighttime/Werewolf is an exception.
The prefix I've set for the Fetid Baghnakhs are 'Legendary', while the 'Light' prefix was available as well, it actually didn't add a bonus to the speed already.
Both have their speed set to 14%
All accessories used have the 'violent' prefix, I've tried to swap out one over 'Menacing', but this didn't worked in any of the resulted builds.
Now, on to the results:
In the two results, this remained consistent:
- Weapon Prefix is Legendary.
- All Accessories have the 'Violent' prefix.
- All stats are made to optimise Melee Speed, not Melee Damage.
- No buffs are used outside of the Werewolf buff.
- Any variation of accessory or armor types are allowed as long as the same piece has the same Melee speed value.
No buffs.
Maximised armor.
Minimized Accessories.
head: 20%
Body: 20%
Legs: 15%
--
Acc1: 12%
Acc2: 12%
Acc3: 10%
Equipment needed: 6
Saving up to 2 Accessories, even 3 in Expert Mode. Adds enough flexibility where only two 12% gloves are required.
However, because the armor had to maximise in speed, there's little room possible to increase the damage with armor.
head: 20%
Body: 0%
Legs: 15%
---
Acc1: 12%
Acc2: 12%
Acc3: 10%
Acc4: 10%
Buff: 5% (Werewolf)
Equipment needed: 6
And then it got me thinking: 'What if I can remove an extra Armor instead of an accessoire?'
There are possibilities, but it does require more investment on the remaining equipment.
Which means only the body or headpiece can be removed, and the other has to keep the 20%
And the Werewolf also has to be active, without buffs, this is the closest you can get.
So far the buffless possibilities are covered, but what about the buffed ones?
So far, there are still only two consumable buffs that increases melee speed:
Well Fed and
Tipsy.
Both increasing with 5% and 10% each, respectively.
(I've really underestimate the power that Tipsy holds, it's an additional Fire Gauntlet without the Fire)
Tipsy is however a very short buff, lasting only 2-4 minutes. If you don't want to be drunk every moment, then you're better off with the buffless build.
So, as long as you keep those buffs active, you should be able to remove even more Accessories on the list.
And here's the result of that one:
Head: 20%
Legs: 15%
---
acc1: 12%
acc2: 12%
acc3: 10%
---
Werewolf: 5%
WellFed: 5%
Tipsy: 10%
A whole Accessory has been spared out. Weew.
It however does require two 12% Accessories, and the Celestial Shell including Werewolf to be active. They all 3 also have to be Violent. But the remaining spots have to be saved for that.
I also went for saving the Solar Flare Leggings, because there are bigger improvements found on the chestpiece.
While it works wonderful, you shouldn't forget to shug another beer bottle to keep it running.
Sakes are recommended as their effect last twice as long.
So, to wrap up phase 1: there is by far no need to maximise the Melee Speed at all to archieve the maximum out of the Baghnakhs.
You can save up to 2 accessories and 1 armor piece to improve other parts on your build, making it a flexible build.
It's extra limited range however, makes it however rather difficult to really make the build useful. Even ground enemies can be difficult to hit because you're holding it so high in the air.
However, Bosses and Minibosses are likely the best choice for this, as their high hitbox makes them an easy target.
Part 2/2: Filling in all saved melee speed for the maximum DPS
We know now that we can save up quite some space just to keep the Fetid Baghnakhs at one frame.
And now the task is how much more DPS we can gain with it.
At first, let's get started with the previous record:
So, what's the best way to fill in the remaining space? Increased damage, or more Critical Strike Change?
To get the best out of it, you have to mix Melee Speed and Melee Damage together, so the accessories are at their best use.
Here's another list that shows the combined Melee speed and Damage:
(Incl. Werewolf) +15% Dmg, +15% Spd, +4% Crt
+12% Dmg, + 12% Spd
+10% Dmg, +10% Spd +2% Crt
+10% Dmg, +10% Spd, On-Fire DoT.
(Okay seriously, will I ever make an Accessory setup guide where the whole Celestial Shell line is not required?)
As for the pure Damage to fill in the slots after the Melee speed has been reached:
+15% Dmg
+12% Dmg
+10% Dmg, +8% Crt
As for the Armor, the Beetle Scalemail Set Bonus would certainely dominate all possibilities.
But because it's close to impossible to reach and keep the full effect with the minimal range. There had to be searched for a alternate with pernament effect:
(Below list is Ignoring bonusses that aren't Melee damage, crit or speed. Also ignoring armor pieces with inferior bonusses)
Single pieces:
Damage + Speed:
+10% Dmg +10% Spd +10% Crt
+8% Dmg + 12% Spd
+8% Dmg +6% Spd + 8% Crt
+5% Dmg +10% Spd + 5% Crt
Pure Damage/Crit:
+ 20% Dmg
+16% Dmg +6 Crt
+17% Crit
+ 22% Dmg
+ 7% Dmg
+ 20% Crit
Pure Speed:
+ 20% Spd
+ 20% Spd
+ 15% Spd
Full Set Bonusses:
The Shinobi Set has been a powerful rival. But with the Solar Flare + Hallowed Mask, it's possible to outdamage it:
32% Dmg + 25% Spd + 10% Crit
+20% Dmg +20% Spd +20% Crt
+17% Dmg +29% Spd + 17% Crit
14(+30)% Dmg + 12(+30)% Spd + 8% Crit
The buffs remains the same as usual:
Well Fed +
Tipsy.
But to really reach the maximum, I'm also putting in
Rage and
Wrath.
The
Ichor Imbue will likely work out the best in this build, although it's use against a Target Dummy is just little.
I'm also going Expert Mode for the extra Accessory slot that we'll need.
To wrap it all up. Here's the ultimate build for the Fetid Baghnakhs:
Accessories have 4x Violent, and 2x Menacing, attempting to swap out one more Violent Prefix will remove the single frame.
And finally, the weapons stats:
(with the 5 potion buffs + Werewolf active)
In a rough calculation:
that's 191 damage x 60 frames = 11.460 DPS at average!
And now I wonder if that's true in reality:
After hitting it for a while, I've screenshotted the dps that showed the highest amount:
11.771 DPS. This looks like that's the highest we can archieve so far.
Though, with this research I've learned that the DPS meter does not register Critical Strikes. Otherwise the average DPS would've lied around the 16k DPS.
This does mean that the 'more damage vs more critical strike' research has been for naught. But at least we've learned something new instead!
Regardless, I'm amazed, back when I couldn't have thought to ever reaching the fifth digit in single-target DPS.
I really wonder if this is the real maximum possible to archieve. Or if there are still possibilities left to improve further.
But regardless, I'm really glad to see that the extra investment has been worth all the extra DPS it created.
Certainely, this has been some effort to research every armor and accessory slot to see which one fits best.
Of course, the first part where you can use the single-frame with more flexibility was probably more useful than just maximising the DPS.
But while I was at it, I might have as well tried figuring that out too.
Hope you've all enjoyed reading.
Feedback is always welcome, as with the strange melee speed, I like to see improvements for this.
Have a good day shredding with flexibility or maximized output.
A weapon with a name that I can barely write well without making corrections.
Introduced since 1.3. And up untill today, it's known as the fastest melee weapon in the game.
Through some melee speed builds, it's discovered that this is capable to archieve a 'single-frame-swing'. Where the weapon moves so fast, that you'll only see one frame at a time.
This actually leads to interesting discoveries. As it does no longer damage-per-swing, but instead, damage-per-frame. This gives them the unique potential to deal the most DPS in the game!
So how can we optimise this?
That's what this thread is about.
I'm splitting this analysis up in 2 parts:
- One that researches the minimum Melee Speed required to reach the single frame.
- And a part about utilising it's DPS.
But first of all, what is this all about?
The single-frame-swing, that I now refer as the 'MaxFrame' by lack of an official term, is the moment where you've reached so much melee speed, that there only will be one frame of the weapon visible at that moment.
The more melee speed you apply in your build, the faster it becomes, and so, the less frames it'll be visible on screen:
Now, the Fetid Baghnakhs, known to be the fastest sword, already shows framed animations by default, hardly visible by my recording method
And this can be improved with melee speed equipment to even reduce more of it's visible frames, untill there's only one solid frame/swing remaining:
And when it has reached one frame, that has the sweet spot.
Because from that moment, every swing only takes one frame, and so it'll deal damage every...single...frame.
This makes an already insane weapon even more insane, dealing at least 5.000 damage within a second!
However, this also causes one major drawback: That frame is the only hitbox, which always seems to be above the characters head.
So you lose the overhead swing protection that it otherwise have to offer. This really poor range makes the use of the MaxFrame very limited.
So you've phenomenal cosmic powerrrr...and itty bitty living space.
I honestly have doubts if this build is in any point useful, besides just showing off DPS, Bosses also put you in a risk because of the low mobility. But I want to give it a try anyways.
The more melee speed you apply in your build, the faster it becomes, and so, the less frames it'll be visible on screen:
Now, the Fetid Baghnakhs, known to be the fastest sword, already shows framed animations by default, hardly visible by my recording method
And this can be improved with melee speed equipment to even reduce more of it's visible frames, untill there's only one solid frame/swing remaining:
And when it has reached one frame, that has the sweet spot.
Because from that moment, every swing only takes one frame, and so it'll deal damage every...single...frame.
This makes an already insane weapon even more insane, dealing at least 5.000 damage within a second!
However, this also causes one major drawback: That frame is the only hitbox, which always seems to be above the characters head.
So you lose the overhead swing protection that it otherwise have to offer. This really poor range makes the use of the MaxFrame very limited.
So you've phenomenal cosmic powerrrr...and itty bitty living space.
I honestly have doubts if this build is in any point useful, besides just showing off DPS, Bosses also put you in a risk because of the low mobility. But I want to give it a try anyways.
Part 1/2: Reducing the required Melee Speed to it's minimum.
There's one thing that's important for this build: Increasing the melee speed beyond the MaxFrame is no use.
Once you've reached the point of the single frame, then there will be no other visible changes afterwards. Even after maxing out the Melee Speed, the single frame stays the same.
So the idea of the build is to minimise the required Melee Speed to reach the MaxFrame. So after that, there's a flexibility available to improve the build by adding damage, or mobility.
There's however one problem...Melee Speed Calculations are weird.
It's not just about adding up 10 + 10. But It's first doing calculations of the first stat before going to the next.
So 100 +10% + 10% is not 120%, but rather 100 + 10% = 110, 110 + 10% = 121% (At least...that's what I think, I don't know the game's code that way)
So it looks like that the amount of equipment and amount of prefixes matters for a higher increase. which makes things difficult when you want to minimise it.
Here's a list of the used Melee Speed modifiers:
As every piece of equipment grants a fixed bonus, it does not matter which one you've equipped, as long as it grants the same amount.
From high to low:
20%
15%
12%
10%
(Excl. werewolf)
7%
6%
5%
4% 'Violent' prefix
Having 10% is the most flexible spot, a lot of accessories have additional effects along with them.
From the 12%, only the Mechanical Glove has an use in damage, the others are basically fillers.
The armors of 15%+ has a huge melee speed bonus, but that's all, no other stats benefits offensive melee users.
Honorable Exclused example:
While the Beetle Armor is undoubtedly the most powerful in both Melee Speed and Damage, it's excluded because it requires constant damage, and that's not helping if you've the shortest range in the game, unless some bosses manages to stay in range for a few seconds, I cannot recommend this armor's set bonus to anything that's not a Destroyer.
From high to low:
20%
15%
12%
10%
7%
6%
5%
4% 'Violent' prefix
Having 10% is the most flexible spot, a lot of accessories have additional effects along with them.
From the 12%, only the Mechanical Glove has an use in damage, the others are basically fillers.
The armors of 15%+ has a huge melee speed bonus, but that's all, no other stats benefits offensive melee users.
Honorable Exclused example:
I want this build to be mostly consistent, which means no temporary buffs, and no specific criterias needed. Day/nighttime/Werewolf is an exception.
The prefix I've set for the Fetid Baghnakhs are 'Legendary', while the 'Light' prefix was available as well, it actually didn't add a bonus to the speed already.
Both have their speed set to 14%
All accessories used have the 'violent' prefix, I've tried to swap out one over 'Menacing', but this didn't worked in any of the resulted builds.
Now, on to the results:
In the two results, this remained consistent:
- Weapon Prefix is Legendary.
- All Accessories have the 'Violent' prefix.
- All stats are made to optimise Melee Speed, not Melee Damage.
- No buffs are used outside of the Werewolf buff.
- Any variation of accessory or armor types are allowed as long as the same piece has the same Melee speed value.
No buffs.
Maximised armor.
Minimized Accessories.
head: 20%
Body: 20%
Legs: 15%
--
Acc1: 12%
Acc2: 12%
Acc3: 10%
Equipment needed: 6
Saving up to 2 Accessories, even 3 in Expert Mode. Adds enough flexibility where only two 12% gloves are required.
However, because the armor had to maximise in speed, there's little room possible to increase the damage with armor.
head: 20%
Body: 0%
Legs: 15%
---
Acc1: 12%
Acc2: 12%
Acc3: 10%
Acc4: 10%
Buff: 5% (Werewolf)
Equipment needed: 6
And then it got me thinking: 'What if I can remove an extra Armor instead of an accessoire?'
There are possibilities, but it does require more investment on the remaining equipment.
Which means only the body or headpiece can be removed, and the other has to keep the 20%
And the Werewolf also has to be active, without buffs, this is the closest you can get.
So far the buffless possibilities are covered, but what about the buffed ones?
So far, there are still only two consumable buffs that increases melee speed:
Both increasing with 5% and 10% each, respectively.
(I've really underestimate the power that Tipsy holds, it's an additional Fire Gauntlet without the Fire)
Tipsy is however a very short buff, lasting only 2-4 minutes. If you don't want to be drunk every moment, then you're better off with the buffless build.
So, as long as you keep those buffs active, you should be able to remove even more Accessories on the list.
And here's the result of that one:
Head: 20%
Legs: 15%
---
acc1: 12%
acc2: 12%
acc3: 10%
---
Werewolf: 5%
WellFed: 5%
Tipsy: 10%
A whole Accessory has been spared out. Weew.
It however does require two 12% Accessories, and the Celestial Shell including Werewolf to be active. They all 3 also have to be Violent. But the remaining spots have to be saved for that.
I also went for saving the Solar Flare Leggings, because there are bigger improvements found on the chestpiece.
While it works wonderful, you shouldn't forget to shug another beer bottle to keep it running.
So, to wrap up phase 1: there is by far no need to maximise the Melee Speed at all to archieve the maximum out of the Baghnakhs.
You can save up to 2 accessories and 1 armor piece to improve other parts on your build, making it a flexible build.
It's extra limited range however, makes it however rather difficult to really make the build useful. Even ground enemies can be difficult to hit because you're holding it so high in the air.
However, Bosses and Minibosses are likely the best choice for this, as their high hitbox makes them an easy target.
Part 2/2: Filling in all saved melee speed for the maximum DPS
We know now that we can save up quite some space just to keep the Fetid Baghnakhs at one frame.
And now the task is how much more DPS we can gain with it.
At first, let's get started with the previous record:
Back in 2016, After I've finished maximising the Melee speed, I was already wondering about the Fetid Baghnakhs and it's single-frame-swing.
So I've done a test, where I've made a DPS score of 9.606
I was already amazed by these results and leaved it with it.
But now I've noticed that it could have a significiant improvement.
However...As it now counts as damager-per-frame. I even had to take note of different factors, including keeping 60 FPS the whole time.
And thus, some parts are starting to get ridiculous just for this research.
like minimising all settings on their lowest. Playing around with the frame-skip. Even resizing the window to a smaller size:
It's getting stupid and I'm testing my Laptop's limitations.
But I want to reach at least a fifth digit in the DPS counter. That's the goal I'm aiming for.
If I had to believe the wiki, 7k -10k DPS was the most estimated result using a single frame, so let's see if it's possible to top the 10k:
So I've done a test, where I've made a DPS score of 9.606
I was already amazed by these results and leaved it with it.
But now I've noticed that it could have a significiant improvement.
However...As it now counts as damager-per-frame. I even had to take note of different factors, including keeping 60 FPS the whole time.
And thus, some parts are starting to get ridiculous just for this research.
like minimising all settings on their lowest. Playing around with the frame-skip. Even resizing the window to a smaller size:
It's getting stupid and I'm testing my Laptop's limitations.
But I want to reach at least a fifth digit in the DPS counter. That's the goal I'm aiming for.
If I had to believe the wiki, 7k -10k DPS was the most estimated result using a single frame, so let's see if it's possible to top the 10k:
So, what's the best way to fill in the remaining space? Increased damage, or more Critical Strike Change?
EDIT: As it turns out, the DPS meter does not count critical hits as a part of it's DPS calculation.
So this still doesn't prove that more damage is preferred over critical strike chance.
Contratory to populair belief, Critical Strike is preferred over damage when it comes to fast hits, because that way you'll get a more average amount of chances.
However, I've done several tests with it, with using the same loadout, but swapping one Critical Accesory with a Damaging one.
I've picked out the highest DPS it could count after hitting the dummy for several seconds. As results:
Menacing Warrior Emblem VS
Lucky Eye of the Golem:
vs
Any Menacing prefix VS any Lucky prefix:
vs
Menacing Avenger Emblem VS
Menacing Destroyer Emblem:
vs
Even swapping out 2% Damage for 8% Critical Strike does not result in a significant more DPS.
I think that's because with more damage, the critical strikes also deals more damage, so on a high speed scale, a critical strike deals more DPS with more damage, rather than more chance.
So this makes clear that this build has to invest into Damage as it's main focus.
So this still doesn't prove that more damage is preferred over critical strike chance.
However, I've done several tests with it, with using the same loadout, but swapping one Critical Accesory with a Damaging one.
I've picked out the highest DPS it could count after hitting the dummy for several seconds. As results:
Any Menacing prefix VS any Lucky prefix:
Even swapping out 2% Damage for 8% Critical Strike does not result in a significant more DPS.
I think that's because with more damage, the critical strikes also deals more damage, so on a high speed scale, a critical strike deals more DPS with more damage, rather than more chance.
So this makes clear that this build has to invest into Damage as it's main focus.
To get the best out of it, you have to mix Melee Speed and Melee Damage together, so the accessories are at their best use.
Here's another list that shows the combined Melee speed and Damage:
(Okay seriously, will I ever make an Accessory setup guide where the whole Celestial Shell line is not required?)
As for the pure Damage to fill in the slots after the Melee speed has been reached:
As for the Armor, the Beetle Scalemail Set Bonus would certainely dominate all possibilities.
But because it's close to impossible to reach and keep the full effect with the minimal range. There had to be searched for a alternate with pernament effect:
(Below list is Ignoring bonusses that aren't Melee damage, crit or speed. Also ignoring armor pieces with inferior bonusses)
Single pieces:
Damage + Speed:
Pure Damage/Crit:
Pure Speed:
Full Set Bonusses:
The Shinobi Set has been a powerful rival. But with the Solar Flare + Hallowed Mask, it's possible to outdamage it:
The buffs remains the same as usual:
But to really reach the maximum, I'm also putting in
The
I'm also going Expert Mode for the extra Accessory slot that we'll need.
To wrap it all up. Here's the ultimate build for the Fetid Baghnakhs:
Accessories have 4x Violent, and 2x Menacing, attempting to swap out one more Violent Prefix will remove the single frame.
And finally, the weapons stats:
In a rough calculation:
that's 191 damage x 60 frames = 11.460 DPS at average!
And now I wonder if that's true in reality:
After hitting it for a while, I've screenshotted the dps that showed the highest amount:
11.771 DPS. This looks like that's the highest we can archieve so far.
Though, with this research I've learned that the DPS meter does not register Critical Strikes. Otherwise the average DPS would've lied around the 16k DPS.
This does mean that the 'more damage vs more critical strike' research has been for naught. But at least we've learned something new instead!
Regardless, I'm amazed, back when I couldn't have thought to ever reaching the fifth digit in single-target DPS.
I really wonder if this is the real maximum possible to archieve. Or if there are still possibilities left to improve further.
But regardless, I'm really glad to see that the extra investment has been worth all the extra DPS it created.
Certainely, this has been some effort to research every armor and accessory slot to see which one fits best.
Of course, the first part where you can use the single-frame with more flexibility was probably more useful than just maximising the DPS.
But while I was at it, I might have as well tried figuring that out too.
Hope you've all enjoyed reading.
Feedback is always welcome, as with the strange melee speed, I like to see improvements for this.
Have a good day shredding with flexibility or maximized output.
Last edited:
