Weapons & Equip New utility weapon: the Dream Piercer (and its upgrade)

[MoultonLava]

This would be a very useful sidearm for most classes, but especially for mage. You'll see why soon. Onto the stats!

Damage: 30 (Typeless)
Use time: 60 (Snail)
Range: same horizontal range as the Breaker Blade
Tooltip: "A long forgotten relic of a ruined kingdom, seemingly worn down by age."
This weapon, when used, has a long startup animation before you strike. If you hit a foe, a small bit of text appears above the enemy's head. It is generic for some foes, like "SPREAD" for Corruptors, etc. But what you really are here for is the buff it gives you, which I'll call "Dreamer" for 8 seconds and a debuff called "Overwhelmed" for 4 seconds for now. It gives:
120 mana back
Increases movement speed and acceleration by 20%
Increases damage by 8%
Allows summons to crit at an 8% chance
and increases life Regen by 2 HP/s(All for about 8 seconds)
and "Overwhelmed" prevents you from using the Dream Piercer for its duration.
This item is obtained from good old Travs (my nickname for Traveling Merchant) for 30 gold in pre Mech.
However, there is an upgrade.

Attuned Dream Piercer
Damage: 80 (typeless
Use time: 55
Range: Same as before
Tooltip: "A fully awakened relic, ready to assist you by all means!"
Crafted with the Dream Piercer, 15 ectoplasm, 10 Beetle Husks, and 10 Chlorophyte

This weapon gives you the "Attuned" buff on hit for 10 seconds, and doesn't inflict "Overwhelmed" at all.
The "Attuned" buff gives:
100% of your max mana back, and this CAN overflow. But that would give you the "Mana Sickness" debuff until it is fully drained (It is a special type that only decreases damage by 10%)
25% increased acceleration and movement speed
12% increased damage
10% increased range for most weapons (excluding certain weapons and the Attuned Dream Piercer)
Allows summons to crit with a 10% chance
increases Regen by 2 HP/s

Give me your thoughts on this below!

 

[Casey Howley]

Fun concept and reference!
The buff might be a tad strong, though.

 

[MoultonLava]

Fun concept and reference!
The buff might be a tad strong, though.

It is very slow and has the range of True Melee, so I think it is fair.

 

[77ForumBone]

This should just be an accessory. It's not very common that weapons give you buffs, so this seems kind of modded and would be out of place. An accessory would just fit the game better. This would remove the whole "classless" vibe from the weapon, sure, but who really cares? There is literally no viable classless weapon in the game, and there doesn't need to be.

 

[MoultonLava]

This should just be an accessory. It's not very common that weapons give you buffs, so this seems kind of modded and would be out of place. An accessory would just fit the game better. This would remove the whole "classless" vibe from the weapon, sure, but who really cares? There is literally no viable classless weapon in the game, and there doesn't need to be.

It is an indirect reference to Hollow Knight's Dream Nail, and it shouldn't have a class due to its support utility. I feel like I did decently balancing it, but I get the modded feel. But, that isn't exactly a great argument on it's own. Elaborate.

 

[77ForumBone]

It is an indirect reference to Hollow Knight's Dream Nail, and it shouldn't have a class due to its support utility.

As much as I respect Hollow Knight, you shouldn't base your whole weapon off of a reference. As for the class thing, then make it an accessory.

but I get the modded feel. But, that isn't exactly a great argument on it's own. Elaborate.

It's a perfectly good argument on it's own. It doesn't fit the game well, therefore it's modded.

 

[MoultonLava]

As much as I respect Hollow Knight, you shouldn't base your whole weapon off of a reference. As for the class thing, then make it an accessory.

It's a perfectly good argument on it's own. It doesn't fit the game well, therefore it's modded.

There are plenty of indirect reference items (cough cough Seargent's United Shield), but I can see your point. But pray tell, how can this be an accessory? Also, just having "its modded" as a complaint is not giving enough evidence, you need to support it.

 

[77ForumBone]

But pray tell, how can this be an accessory?

When an enemy gets hit, there's a chance for the buff to activate on the player.

Also, just having "its modded" as a complaint is not giving enough evidence, you need to support it.

It's a good chunk of evidence. Saying it feels modded literally means "this suggestion doesn't fit the base game," and that's a good amount of evidence. Just because it doesn't have a lot of words doesn't mean it isn't meaningful.

 

[MoultonLava]

When an enemy gets hit, there's a chance for the buff to activate on the player.

Well, this is a decent idea, but the whole idea is an indirect Hollow Knight reference. The only charm like this is ToA, which lashes out when you are hit. Perhaps when you hit a foe, there is a small chance for a orb to spawn that grants these affects? (obviously doesn't work on Dummys or statue enemies)

It's a good chunk of evidence. Saying it feels modded literally means "this suggestion doesn't fit the base game," and that's a good amount of evidence. Just because it doesn't have a lot of words doesn't mean it isn't meaningful.

While the second point is a good one, you still need to provide more than just "it feels modded". tell me WHY it feels modded, besides "it doesn't fit in vanilla". That is not really great evidence.

 

[77ForumBone]

Well, this is a decent idea, but the whole idea is an indirect Hollow Knight reference. The only charm like this is ToA, which lashes out when you are hit. Perhaps when you hit a foe, there is a small chance for a orb to spawn that grants these affects? (obviously doesn't work on Dummys or statue enemies)

I know, but gameplay and fitting in should be prioritized over a reference.

While the second point is a good one, you still need to provide more than just "it feels modded". tell me WHY it feels modded, besides "it doesn't fit in vanilla". That is not really great evidence.

It feels modded because it doesn't fit the base game. That's why, and that's enough. I know you said "besides it doesn't fit vanilla," but that's a bit silly because you're trying to limit what I can say for some reason.

 

[MoultonLava]

It feels modded because it doesn't fit the base game. That's why, and that's enough. I know you said "besides it doesn't fit vanilla," but that's a bit silly because you're trying to limit what I can say for some reason.

I don't want to limit you, but I really want to know EXACTLY why. I feel like it could fit, even though no item like it exists in vanilla. Just because it doesn't exist in vanilla right now doesn't mean it cant fit.

 

[77ForumBone]

even though no item like it exists in vanilla.

You answered your own question lol

Just because it doesn't exist in vanilla right now doesn't mean it cant fit.

Yeah, and making your weapon an accessory will make the thing fit better.

 

[Stellar Mastodon 267]

I also think it would do better as an accessory. Either way, what does it look like? Because you compared its range to it, I’m imagining it’s like the Breaker Blade.

 

[MoultonLava]

You answered your own question lol

Why is adding a completely new thing to vanilla seen as modded? I mean, this isn't far fetched considering everything vanilla has (Shimmer, the moon events, etc), so why is it an issue?

Yeah, and making your weapon an accessory will make the thing fit better.

While I do like making vanilla friendly things, I would have made it an accessory if I really wanted it to be (I can understand your point here)

 

[77ForumBone]

Why is adding a completely new thing to vanilla seen as modded? I mean, this isn't far fetched considering everything vanilla has (Shimmer, the moon events, etc), so why is it an issue?

The execution feels modded though. Again, making the weapon an accessory will fix that.

While I do like making vanilla friendly things, I would have made it an accessory if I really wanted it to be (I can understand your point here)

?

 

[MoultonLava]

I also think it would do better as an accessory. Either way, what does it look like? Because you compared its range to it, I’m imagining it’s like the Breaker Blade.

It has a similar animation to the Dream Nail, appearing behind you as you charge it, than swiping forward. This swipe has the same horizontal range as the Breaker Blade.

 

[MoultonLava]

The execution feels modded though. Again, making the weapon an accessory will fix that.

I prefer adding weapons over accessories, and i have said it before. And it can be considered slightly secret because of the method, similar to the Shield (Travs is brutal sometimes with his spawning method), but that's a personal preference. I respect your opinion, but I ain't changing nothing.

 

[77ForumBone]

I prefer adding weapons over accessories, and i have said it before.

That's not a very great argument. I don't this that personal preference should decide whether something should be changed or not.

And it can be considered slightly secret because of the method, similar to the Shield(Travs is brutal sometimes), but that's a personal preference.

I don't understand a word you just said in that lol

I respect your opinion, but I ain't changing nothing.

I don't think that's a great philosiphy. You shouldn't be sidelining what other people say because you don't agree with it.

 

[Casey Howley]

While I can agree this would probably be better as an accessory, I feel the need to bring up a few things:

It's not very common that weapons give you buffs, so this seems kind of modded and would be out of place.

While technically true, there aren't many, that there are weapons that give buffs means it is a decidedly not modded aspect.

As much as I respect Hollow Knight, you shouldn't base your whole weapon off of a reference.

As MoultonLava mentioned just after this, there are plenty of weapons that are directly based around being references. So, again, a decidedly not modded aspect.

even though no item like it exists in vanilla

This is true only when considering the concept as a whole. Each of its aspects has vanilla roots. It's effectively a very slow spear/shortsword, with a windup/charge animation (See: Last Prism, Sleepy Octopod, and maces to an extent), that applies a player buff on hit (See: A bunch of whips, and Life Drain). The Overwhelmed debuff is effectively a very niche version of Cursed.

But pray tell, how can this be an accessory?

Honestly? It could function almost completely identically. (See: Bone Glove)

The problem I see is that the buff may be doing too much at once, which is why it would fit better as an accessory.

On the other hand, as a weapon it doesn't even need to be classless per se. It could just as easily be given any damage type and simply not scale, or scale very little.

---

Now...

It's a good chunk of evidence. Saying it feels modded literally means "this suggestion doesn't fit the base game," and that's a good amount of evidence. Just because it doesn't have a lot of words doesn't mean it isn't meaningful.

I'm sorry, but Moulton's totally right. "It feels modded" is not good criticism on its own, and also doesn't make sense in the greater context of the game. There's plenty of content that feels modded, but isn't. You needed to clarify, not double down on a vague and unhelpful statement.

I prefer adding weapons over accessories, and i have said it before. And it can be considered slightly secret because of the method, similar to the Shield (Travs is brutal sometimes with his spawning method), but that's a personal preference. I respect your opinion, but I ain't changing nothing.

1. Liking making weapons is totally fine. The statement isn't helpful to the conversation, though, and feels more like a deflection.
2. It's not exactly secret, just random chance. Again: Not a helpful statement.
3. Understandable sentiment, but you need to be more careful of how you say it. The wording, combined with the not entirely relevant statements preceding it makes it sound more dismissive than you may intend.

 

[zenithspeed]

in most suggestions, i can imagine how the thing would work if it were added, including things like how its text and tooltips would look in the inventory, its actual behaviour, etc.
but this, for whatever reason, is just utterly incomprehensible to me
i'm not saying it's bad by any means, i just can't seem to understand it for whatever reason ¯\_(ツ)_/¯