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Re-Logic Announces Terraria: Journey's End at E3!

Nicol Bolas

Terrarian
higher resolution visuals across the board. Since the second thing is well beyond what is to be reasonably expected of an update to an existing game,
That's not the reason why "higher resolution visuals" aren't going to happen. The game looks the way it does because that's how the developers want it to look. It's an explicit throwback to SNES-era visuals, just done on a much larger scale.

Asking for "higher resolution visuals" out of Terraria is like asking for Schindler's List to be in color. It is the way it is because it's supposed to be that way.

that just leaves the inventory management improvements, which thus far seem modest at best. I've still got my fingers crossed that bigger stack sizes and many more inventory slots for players and chests are among the additions yet to be revealed, (and with yet more items being added to the game, will be needed more than ever,)
Exactly how much inventory management do people want? I've heard lots of people complaining about inventory on this board, but no improvement ever seems enough.

Ever since chests (and personal storage items) were upgraded to hold 40 items instead of 20, I would say that chest size is about as big as it needs to be. The only chests I have that ever overflow with stuff are chests containing ultra-common materials like dirt or stone. And yes, multiple playthroughs do tend to give me a lot of copies of armor and stuff, but... you can sell the craftible stuff off. After all, it's not like you can't craft another one if you want to try it out. And having a button to dump all the stuff in your inventory into nearby chests that have the same item is a Godsend for management of most stuff.


Oh sure, it'd be nice to have larger stacks of some items, particularly potions. And the torch limit of 99 is ridiculous, considering that its components of wood and gel both come in stacks of 999 these days. But overall, I'd say that even 1.3.5 is in a pretty good place.

The only time inventory gets annoying for me these days is doing dungeon/jungle dives, when you fill up your storage space half-way (or less) through and have to go dump stuff off before you can explore deeper. But that's a relatively minor pain point. Overall, regularly having to go back to base to dump things off is generally a useful part of the game. It encourages you not to carry around lots of stuff, organize your chests back at home, and such.

Do people just want infinite personal storage space?
 
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ASHIDA

Terrarian
I wish there was infinite storage. But terraria lost its chance at that since it has such a basic inventory management system that no matter how many spaces you add, it always becomes cluttered. The void bag doesnt change anything since your doubling the inventory space you have to manage. From what ive seen
:nymph::zombie::zombie::zombie:
 

Exodus Starlit

Dungeon Spirit
I wish there was infinite storage. But terraria lost its chance at that since it has such a basic inventory management system that no matter how many spaces you add, it always becomes cluttered. The void bag doesnt change anything since your doubling the inventory space you have to manage. From what ive seen
:nymph::zombie::zombie::zombie:
And that is propably why you should sell everything that you don't need like spair pairs of accessories, weapons, ...
I ussually use about 10 chests.
 

Nicol Bolas

Terrarian
To me, building a home base is a fundamental aspect of the game. The way the game is structured, the need to have a place to put your stuff comes at around the same time when you can start to benefit from building houses for your NPCs. As such, you tend to build both at the same place and time. And the rest of the game tends to expect you to have such a place.

If you have infinite personal storage space, along with a good inventory system to manage carrying around so much stuff... then why bother having a home base? If you need to craft something, then just drop your crafting stations and craft it. If you need to quit the game, then just throw down a quick respawn point (bed+building+walls) wherever you are, so you can pick up from there.

Infinite storage space would completely change the character of the game. The current game centers around making sorties out into the world and bringing stuff back to your home. As you get better, your sorties can go for longer, but you're always going to come home in the end.

The game you're talking about has only the world; it has no personal home for yourself. Or at least, there is no gameplay incentive to build a personal home for yourself. There's no reason to frequently go back to a particular place. You're just always moving forward, always mining further, always this and that.

In the current game, when you die, you go back to spawn. As such, most players build their home base either around the world spawn or somewhere near it (because new players don't know how beds work). So if they get killed halfway through a long sortie... well, yes they died and have to go pick up their money. But hey, they can dump off some stuff, and maybe craft some gear so long as they're here. It's a consolation prize. In your hypothetical game, there's never a consolation prize for dying; you just lose progress.

Also, consider how this changes the game's design. Look at the transition from Gold Tier to Demonite Tier. This transition happens, essentially, on the surface. After getting Gold Tier stuff, you're "supposed" to go kill the Eye of Chthulu. But that's best fought in an open area, not underground. IE: the surface.

In the current game, this is fine, since you're always returning to the surface to drop stuff off. But in your hypothetical version, this is a weird transition. The surface is that annoying place you go when you die or need to deal with NPCs or harvest wood. You never really spend much time there. So if the EoC spawns, why would you consider fighting it on the surface?

And speaking of NPCs, because the character of the game you're describing is one where you're always pushing forward, always going farther, with no central home base, NPCs become an odd annoyance. If you need to buy or sell stuff, or use special NPC functions, you have to slog all the way back to spawn, then recall back to where you were. In the current game, you're always doing that, so it doesn't feel as off-putting. Indeed, if you have NPC needs, you'll usually wait until you're full up on inventory before recalling back to spawn.

Indeed, given that you're not frequently coming near where the Guide is, it may be that a lot of people don't even realize what his purpose is or follow his advice. They may not even build houses for NPCs, so they would be missing out on a whole dimension of play.

This wouldn't be a better version of Terraria; it would be a game with a fundamentally different feel to it. A game that would need a substantially different design to work.
 

Sterling

Terrarian
To me, building a home base is a fundamental aspect of the game.
Your first sentence explains why the rest of your message is misguided.

To you, building a centralized base is important. To you, that specific method of gameplay and advancement is the most enjoyable or "correct." But that's not true for everyone. Even a cursory browse of these forums will demonstrate the varied approach users take with this game. Some prefer collecting, some building extravagant towns, some adventuring, some exploring, some becoming master baiters, and so forth. Terraria at its core is a sandbox game and it can be experienced in any way users want. Evidence for this include the varied avenues of advancement available to players. If progression of the adventure is your goal, you're not limited to any one method. With fishing, you can skip directly into Molten Armor by fishing up a Reaver Shark. Or, you can use explosives to skip directly to Hardmode. These are two of the more radical alternate choices, but many others exist. You're not locked into any one progression method. There is no "correct" way of playing Terraria.

Some would prefer to not fuss with inventory as much. Some would rather explore for longer periods of time. These play styles are just as valid.
 

ASHIDA

Terrarian
And that is propably why you should sell everything that you don't need like spair pairs of accessories, weapons, ...
I ussually use about 10 chests.
Yea most if not everyone does that since there is no easier option than more or less chests to sort and sell from. I mean complaining to change how space is managed in terraria will always be a thing. So what can you do but deal with it :pumpking:
 

Nicol Bolas

Terrarian
Your first sentence explains why the rest of your message is misguided.

To you, building a centralized base is important. To you, that specific method of gameplay and advancement is the most enjoyable or "correct."
But that's not what I said. Indeed, I never even claimed it was particularly "enjoyable", let alone correct.

My point is that the game is designed around it. Significant aspects of the game are built under the assumption that you will have frequent trips back to base. That's not about what's important to me; that's about what's important to the game.

Terraria is not a magical "do anything" box. There are limits as to what you can do, and the game is designed to condition certain behaviors into players, rewarding some behaviors and punishing others. You cannot enter Hardmode without killing the Wall of Flesh. You cannot fight Plantera without first killing the three Mechanical bosses. You cannot fight the Moon Lord without first defeating the four pillars. And so forth.

And you cannot collect more stuff than your inventory will hold without having a place to dump the excess off. And the game is designed with the expectation that you will have such a place.

Removing that limitation is akin to removing the mana cost of magical weapons: it's conceptually simple, but so much of the balancing and design of the game is built on assuming that magical weapons cost mana that if you did so, you're now talking about a completely unbalanced play experience.

And hey, maybe that would be a more fun play experience. But it's not the same experience as Terraria's play experience.

Even a cursory browse of these forums will demonstrate the varied approach users take with this game.
There's something important to remember:

Terraria still has to work for people who've never played it before.

That's something that people who've played this game for years often forget: what it's like to start fresh with absolutely no idea what's going on. What it's like to try to learn the game without going to the Wiki or without using other outside knowledge.

These are the people who, with infinite inventory, are going to spend all their time underground, and then have no idea how to progress. These are the people who will forget that the Guide exists and not learn important tasks like building houses and such. These are the people that I was specifically talking about.

Terraria is different from and superior to Minecraft because it has a clear progression system and it is designed to try to push you along that system. And part of that process involves going back to the surface regularly.

Take that away, and the experience becomes something quite different.
 
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Sterling

Terrarian
But that's not what I said. Indeed, I never even claimed it was particularly "enjoyable", let alone correct.

My point is that the game is designed around it. Significant aspects of the game are built under the assumption that you will have frequent trips back to base. That's not about what's important to me; that's about what's important to the game.

(...)

Terraria is different from and superior to Minecraft because it has a clear progression system and it is designed to try to push you along that system. And part of that process involves going back to the surface regularly.
This is an assertion you keep making but have no evidence for. The game absolutely is not designed around a base or singular location of any kind. You can just as easily progress without making a "base" (there are a variety of ways of accessing NPCs). You can progress without even using chests entirely, only keeping items which you want to use at the current moment. People CHOOSE to hoard large amounts of items and people CHOOSE to place all NPCs in one location as that is their chosen style of play. This sort of play is neither strictly enforced nor required.

That's something that people who've played this game for years often forget: what it's like to start fresh with absolutely no idea what's going on. What it's like to try to learn the game without going to the Wiki or without using other outside knowledge.

These are the people who, with infinite inventory, are going to spend all their time underground, and then have no idea how to progress. These are the people who will forget that the Guide exists and not learn important tasks like building houses and such. These are the people that I was specifically talking about.
Again, the one type of play style you assert the game is "designed around" is not required nor is it enforced anywhere in the progression system of the game. So, too, are people's definition of "progression" different as individuals have different goals in Terraria... it is a sandbox after all. A new player can choose to play the game literally any way they want... which, again, is evidenced by just looking around this forum and see how people describe their experience.

Expanded or "infinite" inventory won't negatively impact the game in any way, shape, or form. All that will do is ease inventory management for the folks that want to spend more time doing literally anything else. Those that enjoy mucking about in a base or otherwise playing around with their collection are still perfectly free to do so.
 

Good day Terrarians!

As you hopefully noticed, we had some pretty big news to share at E3 today! During the PC Gaming Show, we revealed live to the world that the in-development 1.3.6 update is no more... the next update to Terraria will in fact be the fourth major update we have developed for the game, which we are calling Terraria: Journey's End!

For those that were unable to watch the reveal live, we have shared the teaser trailer below - along with some key details and a bit of what we expect will be your FAQ. As we always do, we have left out a ton of juicy details and other content and features that will be included with Terraria: Journey's End. Some of those have or might be spoiled between now and launch, but others will remain a secret until you have the update in your hands later this year. So, without further ado... we present to you Terraria: Journey's End!




KEY FEATURES REVEALED THUS FAR

  • Terraria: Journey’s End includes a full re-visit to all elements of Terraria. Over time, some things may have felt left behind or made obsolete by newer content. No more! Old things made new and new elements added to flesh out the overall experience – think you know all there is to know about Terraria? Think again!
  • Terraria: Journey’s End will include over 800 new items for players to find or craft!
  • Terraria: Journey’s End adds new foes to defeat and challenges to overcome as you seek fortune and glory.
  • Terraria: Journey’s End will see a full revamp of world generation – including overall improvements and a handful of new mini-biomes to explore.
  • Quality of Life improvements abound in Terraria: Journey’s End! From Block Swap to the Void Vault, these will ensure that the player spends more time doing what they enjoy most – and having more fun at the same time.
  • Terraria: Journey’s End will see the addition of an in-game Bestiary. As players defeat higher numbers of any given foe, they will learn more about them – from key statistics to even what each foe can drop as loot!
  • Terraria: Journey’s End will bring the hallowed game of Golf to Terraria. Golf? That’s right, Golf. Trust us, it is insanely fun – so get your golf skills up to par now!
  • Terraria: Journey’s End will add an all new difficulty mode. Beyond the existing Expert Mode, this is intended to be a true challenge for the most experienced and skilled Terrarians – a true gauntlet for the best of the best. Will your gaming skills and creativity be up to the task?
  • Terraria: Journey's End adds in all new and enhanced weather effects.
In case you missed any spoilers along the way (outside of the trailer above), we have created a spoiler compendium for your viewing pleasure. You can find that by clicking the link below:



….and that’s just what we have in so far – the team is going to remain hard at work over the next several months to not only perfect what we have in and planned now, but to also add in a handful of other surprises and features that we will share with everyone in the coming months. Stay tuned and watch our official Forums/Discord/Twitter/Instagram/Facebook for regular spoilers and reveals in the run-up to the launch of Terraria: Journey’s End!



TERRARIA: JOURNEY'S END FAQ
Q: So, is Journey's End the same as Terraria 1.4?
A: Yes! This is the fourth major update to the game, continuing in the tradition of 1.1-1.2-1.3

Q: Will Journey's End cost extra?
A: For owners of Terraria on PC (Steam/GOG/Etc), Journey's End will be a free update - this continues our long-standing tradition of providing substantial free content to our fans.

Q: Will Journey's End come to Consoles? Mobile? Switch?
A: Eventually, yes - but likely not at the exact same time.

Q: When will Journey's End release?
A: We expect to have this update out prior to the end of the year. However, as we always say... it will be ready when it is ready.

Q: What happened to 1.3.6?
A: As we got further and further into development, we started to realize that 1.3.6 was reaching a tipping point... one where if we decided to add in a handful of big ideas we have had for some time, it would really feel worthy of a 1.X tier update.

Q: Why call it Journey's End instead of 1.4?
A: Our current plan is for this to be the crowning update to Terraria. We do not currently have any plans to tackle additional updates, outside of fixes and maybe a few tidbits here and there to shore things up.

Q: So, what does that mean for Terraria? Re-Logic?
A: Terraria will remain the vibrant and amazing game that it always has been! There is plenty more coming down the road for Console/Switch/Mobile (including some things we have not revealed just yet), and with the available mods - plus any future mods - on top of what is a VERY robust core game, we are confident Terraria will be trucking along for many, many years to come. Of course, we will stay involved with all of you - you make this possible, and we always enjoy hanging out.

For Re-Logic, this means that we will finally be tackling our second title. We do not yet know what this will be - and it may not even be a Terraria title - so expect a time of silence from us on that front until we are ready to share more what we decide to pursue. :)

Q: You said the spoilers and trailer don't show everything in Journey's End. What else can we expect?
A: From additional content to some really cool features, we only wanted to share some selected things at this point (plus there is only so much we can pack into a 90 second video!). We have spoiled more in the previous months and will continue to do so as we head to launch. As always, we will leave some surprises in there for you to discover on your own!
Well, this is it. The last update, the end of a great journey of a world called Terraria.
I'm not ready for it to be over. Just like that.
What a way to go.
 

Lord Donovan

Official Terrarian
Regarding the debate on how to play Terraria, what I personally like is exploring, collecting and gathering materials/equipment, fighting monsters, and massive elaborate base building. Inventory management is an unfun speedbump along the way to doing more of those fun things. Storing stuff from the last haul and/or constant stops midway through to move stuff to the mobile storage items gets in the way of exploration and monster fighting, and having to dedicate a huge section of every base to walls of chests to hold it all limits building freedom for functional bases. I don't really like making the main floor of every base ever a warehouse, but having to travel further out of my way every. single. time. I need to store or retrieve something is even more annoying.

So bottom line, inventory management is the eternal pebble in my Terraria shoe, and the one thing I always hope for updates to improve the most. It would be glorious if you simply had so many storage slots you never again needed to stop and toss some blinkroot in the garbage just to free up space for other things. It would be great if you only had to place more chests in bases for additional decorations or design reasons rather than needing raw additional storage space. And as is, I don't really see how having to do either is at all a meaningful part of the challenge or experience of Terraria.

Well, larger stack amounts have been shown off. The new Void Vault item will be useful with item management, too. I wouldn't be suprised to see more inventory managment features later on.
Hey, that is some good news. Thanks for sharing, and consider me a little more hyped. Exactly how much depends on exactly how many items get their stacks increased and by how much, but any stack size increases mean more stuff in less slots, and thus effectively more space in chests and player inventories.

With that said, the ideal new stack sizes would be 9999 max for everything, if you ask me. And before anybody argues about limits on displayable numbers, the game can already display a 4 digit stack size as-is, and the numbers fit fine. As for why stack sizes that big are needed, well, if anybody has tried building a truly huge base, then you appreciate how fast you can go through 999 of something. And even if you don't personally mine, store, and place many thousands of units of stone and such, it's still no skin off your nose to make things more convenient for those of us who do.

That's not the reason why "higher resolution visuals" aren't going to happen. The game looks the way it does because that's how the developers want it to look. It's an explicit throwback to SNES-era visuals, just done on a much larger scale.

Asking for "higher resolution visuals" out of Terraria is like asking for Schindler's List to be in color. It is the way it is because it's supposed to be that way.
First, I'm not so sure that Terraria's sprite sizes were a choice made on aesthetic principle rather than practical limits to begin with. Remember that the average screen resolution has changed since Terraria released, I for one sure wasn't running 2560x1440 back then. Along with weaker hardware at the time, I'd say the original sprite sizes made a lot more sense technically when the game was first started. And beyond that, while the game went on to be a huge success, it started out as a shoestring indie title by all evidence, in which case, smaller sprites may have simply been the best they could do with the art budget available. Again, if you remember original Terraria, the visuals were just plain rougher all around. Although the overall sprite sizes never changed, tons of stuff has been retouched and improved since then. As such, between technology and limited starter budget, I think Terraria's sprite sizes may very well have been more of a practical choice than an aesthetic one.

But with that said, it's still quite possible you're right that the sprite sizes are exactly what the developers want them to be. Even if that's the case though, while they have every right to make the game how they want, the consumer is still equally free to have their own preferences. And this consumer wants higher resolution visuals. (And has for a long time now.) Don't get me wrong, I very much like the overall colorful cartoony style of it all, and the 2d pixel vibe. I don't want it to be more realistic, or gritty, or grey. I just want character sprites to be more than about two dozen pixels tall, not to mention individual tiles to be more than 8 pixels across. Keep the overall style the same and double the resolution of individual assets and I'd be a happy camper. SNES era visuals are also my little kid gamer happy memories nostalgia zone, but even when I was playing games like Chrono Trigger back then, with no idea what exactly "pixels" or "resolution" meant, I still would have liked it if the characters looked closer to the amount of details the drawings on the covers and instructions manuals had. Or in other words, I'm personally nostalgic for the old SNES colorful and stylized art direction, but not the technical limitations.
 

Cyberra

Skeletron Prime
On stack sizes, I saw a picture once of someone using a modded stack of bullets to avoid running out and having to get more, and that stack size was seven digits long. If stack size of a million can fit in one of those slots, legitly or not, a perfectly legit stack size of "9999" can fit no problem
 
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frogs.poison

Terrarian
Question - Does this mean that super mega sized maps are off the table completely now? I was wanting a map that would take an hour to fall through a hellavator!
 

Terro

Terrarian
The difference is that Terraria is a very progression-focused game, so any time something is added, it feels like it adds more possibilities, more neat loot to find, etc.
With Minecraft, however, most of what they add is... Let's face it: Window dressing, and nothing more, with no useful purpose. A lot of the blocks they add don't even feel all that great for building with. Minecraft also has a more convoluted crafting system.

But yes, this is set to be the last major update. And honestly, I think Terraria stopped being a "simple game" long ago. The core concept is simple, yes, but there's a lot you can do. Again compared to Minecraft, you have only a few things you can really DO in vanilla, and instead of adding more to do, they just add more... things, most of the time. One (Terraria updates) is very satisfying, as it gives you drive to re-explore the whole game from top to bottom. The other (Minecraft updates) is... Disappointing, and usually just makes me groan personally, and wonder how they'll manage to somehow make the game run even worse while completely rewriting internal code the 17th time to utterly break every mod in existence for seemingly zero benefit to the end users.

*COUGH*
Anyway, yes.
I think with this update, Terraria will be in a wonderful spot: Enough real content to continue to be exciting time and time again, all the old clunky mechanics revisited at once to make everything feel fresh and modern without losing its charm, and devs who're really in-touch with the community still around to fix any bugs that come up, maybe even implementing small ideas here and there as time goes on.
Yeah man, totally agree. Also, like your sig. Suggestion; Ask people to suggest on other people's suggestions on your suggestions suggestions... of suggestions? Derp .________.
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I just hope that golf can deal damage based on speed or something. Golf only playthrough? Elaborate contraptions that put golfballs up to such insane speeds that they can 1shot the Dungeon Guardian? Event-themed minigolf that can actually beat said event? GOLF.
Remember, the defence is (supposedly) infinite, 1 DMG no matter what. maybe an elaborate 'ping pong" setup where the player teleports up and down, and the balls bounce back and forth/up and down on pink slime blocks? that might work, though difficult to start probably.
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Question - Does this mean that super mega sized maps are off the table completely now? I was wanting a map that would take an hour to fall through a hellavator!
PHHHT *juice sprays across monitor* YOU WANNA TAKE A DAY TO MAKE THAT HELLEVATOR?!
 

Nicol Bolas

Terrarian
This is an assertion you keep making but have no evidence for. The game absolutely is not designed around a base or singular location of any kind. You can just as easily progress without making a "base" (there are a variety of ways of accessing NPCs). You can progress without even using chests entirely, only keeping items which you want to use at the current moment. People CHOOSE to hoard large amounts of items and people CHOOSE to place all NPCs in one location as that is their chosen style of play. This sort of play is neither strictly enforced nor required.
I feel like we're kind of talking past each other. I'll say something like "Significant aspects of the game are built under the assumption that you will have frequent trips back to base," but you seem to read that as "He believes that this sort of play is strictly enforced and required by Terraria."

That's not what I'm saying.

As an analogy, consider the average small car. You can drive one more or less anywhere the wheels will take you. On-road, off-road, through your neighbor's house, wherever. However, it is clear from the engineering of the car that you are expected to drive it on a road. If you start going through a forest, you will quickly find that your driving experience is severely curtailed by frequent breakdowns and maintenance.

The makers of the car do not "enforce or require" that you drive on a road. But it is clear from the design of such a car that road driving is actively encouraged and expected.

By contrast, the design of a tank is a lot more... liberal about where you're expected to go. If you want to take a drive through your neighbor's house, the tank will have a lot easier time of it than a car. Both vehicles are theoretically capable of going anywhere, but one of them is clearly better designed for that. The other one is designed for less road damage and better gas mileage.

That is the kind of thing I'm talking about. Not hard "enforce and required" rules, but soft "encouragement".

Consider Shadow Orbs/Crimson Hearts. Why bother surrounding them in blocks that you need a higher-level pickaxe for? After all, you can just bomb through them, right? If it's so easy to get through them that you don't even need gear you craft from mining, why not just make them mineable with a copper pickaxe from the start?

Because new players, generally, will not think to use explosives to get through the stone (or, more specifically, they will usually encounter explosives after they've already invested time in the underground). So the "barrier" encourages new players to do the things you need to do to get a pickaxe that can mine it. New players are encouraged to go exploring in the underground, which helps them learn the game. They learn how to navigate the space and fight stuff. They learn how to build stuff. They'll likely get the components for a grappling hook or maybe find one. They'll get the hearts and armor they need to actually survive a boss fight. And so forth.

The fact that a barrier can be bypassed doesn't make that barrier meaningless or nonexistent.

By limiting your inventory, you make it hard for someone to explore without stopping to store stuff away (not impossible. Just difficult and unnatural; humans are instinctively hoarders). And because travel is not instantaneous, having a centralized place for such storage is entirely natural. And because dying puts you at the world spawn point, and because the surface has the least-dangerous enemies, putting that centralized place near spawn makes logical sense. Having all of the NPCs near each other and near your storage place makes sense, because the player needs to frequently contact them.

The game does not make you do this. But you cannot say that players are not encouraged by the game's design to do it. Not every player will, but most players do. Especially players who do not know the game yet.

I had a very difficult time learning Terraria 1.1. Before I found the Wiki, I didn't understand basic things like building NPC houses or what progression looked like. Crafting was a rather confusing concept for me. And so on.

But even I managed to figure out the idea of harvesting chests and bringing them back to the world spawn, building a base around them. I didn't need to be told to do that. I didn't need to read about it on the Wiki. The game certainly didn't "strictly enforce or require" me to do it. But I did it anyway.

And I'll bet you did too. Just like most people did on their first playthrough. Because the game encouraged us to do so. By doing so, the game got easier/more manageable.

And because the designers know that new players will almost certainly do this, they can design aspects of the game to expect this behavior. They create bosses best fought in more open areas or in specialized arenas, which are easier to build on the surface than underground. The Corruption/Crimson are designed to be entered from the surface. They created a dungeon that is very difficult to get into (especially for a new player who is still trying to understand what's going on) unless you go through the main entrance... which is on the surface. And so forth.

Yes, you can choose alternate ways to handle all of those things. You can kill bosses anywhere. You can use explosives to get into Corrupted/Crimson chasms. You can Reaver Shark your way into the dungeon. Etc. But you cannot tell me that the game's design does not encourage the player to confront these challenges from the surface.

Sandboxes still have design; they're not just a bunch of features that get thrown into a blender.

These particular designed aspects of Terraria, ones which expect you to tackle certain problems from the surface? They exist because the limited inventory design encourages players to make the surface their home. Take away the inventory limits, and new players will be far less frequent visitors to the surface. And that will impact how they deal with problems. It will make it harder for them to solve certain issues if they don't see the surface as a natural place.

Yes, players who've been playing the game for years will have no problems with dealing with an infinite inventory. They know how the bosses work and how the game flows, and they have all the knowledge needed to manipulate it as they see fit.

The people who will be negatively affected are the ones who have no experience or knowledge in playing the game.

So if the current game were to be adjusted to allow for infinite inventory, maybe it should be something that drops from an enemy in the world. Maybe it could be a reward for beating Master Mode Moon Lord (though that's a bit extreme, but it would definitely get me to play Master Mode...). That way, the process of getting new players to understand the game won't be affected.
 

Spooderman79

Terrarian
I feel like we're kind of talking past each other. I'll say something like "Significant aspects of the game are built under the assumption that you will have frequent trips back to base," but you seem to read that as "He believes that this sort of play is strictly enforced and required by Terraria."

That's not what I'm saying.

As an analogy, consider the average small car. You can drive one more or less anywhere the wheels will take you. On-road, off-road, through your neighbor's house, wherever. However, it is clear from the engineering of the car that you are expected to drive it on a road. If you start going through a forest, you will quickly find that your driving experience is severely curtailed by frequent breakdowns and maintenance.

The makers of the car do not "enforce or require" that you drive on a road. But it is clear from the design of such a car that road driving is actively encouraged and expected.

By contrast, the design of a tank is a lot more... liberal about where you're expected to go. If you want to take a drive through your neighbor's house, the tank will have a lot easier time of it than a car. Both vehicles are theoretically capable of going anywhere, but one of them is clearly better designed for that. The other one is designed for less road damage and better gas mileage.

That is the kind of thing I'm talking about. Not hard "enforce and required" rules, but soft "encouragement".

Consider Shadow Orbs/Crimson Hearts. Why bother surrounding them in blocks that you need a higher-level pickaxe for? After all, you can just bomb through them, right? If it's so easy to get through them that you don't even need gear you craft from mining, why not just make them mineable with a copper pickaxe from the start?

Because new players, generally, will not think to use explosives to get through the stone (or, more specifically, they will usually encounter explosives after they've already invested time in the underground). So the "barrier" encourages new players to do the things you need to do to get a pickaxe that can mine it. New players are encouraged to go exploring in the underground, which helps them learn the game. They learn how to navigate the space and fight stuff. They learn how to build stuff. They'll likely get the components for a grappling hook or maybe find one. They'll get the hearts and armor they need to actually survive a boss fight. And so forth.

The fact that a barrier can be bypassed doesn't make that barrier meaningless or nonexistent.

By limiting your inventory, you make it hard for someone to explore without stopping to store stuff away (not impossible. Just difficult and unnatural; humans are instinctively hoarders). And because travel is not instantaneous, having a centralized place for such storage is entirely natural. And because dying puts you at the world spawn point, and because the surface has the least-dangerous enemies, putting that centralized place near spawn makes logical sense. Having all of the NPCs near each other and near your storage place makes sense, because the player needs to frequently contact them.

The game does not make you do this. But you cannot say that players are not encouraged by the game's design to do it. Not every player will, but most players do. Especially players who do not know the game yet.

I had a very difficult time learning Terraria 1.1. Before I found the Wiki, I didn't understand basic things like building NPC houses or what progression looked like. Crafting was a rather confusing concept for me. And so on.

But even I managed to figure out the idea of harvesting chests and bringing them back to the world spawn, building a base around them. I didn't need to be told to do that. I didn't need to read about it on the Wiki. The game certainly didn't "strictly enforce or require" me to do it. But I did it anyway.

And I'll bet you did too. Just like most people did on their first playthrough. Because the game encouraged us to do so. By doing so, the game got easier/more manageable.

And because the designers know that new players will almost certainly do this, they can design aspects of the game to expect this behavior. They create bosses best fought in more open areas or in specialized arenas, which are easier to build on the surface than underground. The Corruption/Crimson are designed to be entered from the surface. They created a dungeon that is very difficult to get into (especially for a new player who is still trying to understand what's going on) unless you go through the main entrance... which is on the surface. And so forth.

Yes, you can choose alternate ways to handle all of those things. You can kill bosses anywhere. You can use explosives to get into Corrupted/Crimson chasms. You can Reaver Shark your way into the dungeon. Etc. But you cannot tell me that the game's design does not encourage the player to confront these challenges from the surface.

Sandboxes still have design; they're not just a bunch of features that get thrown into a blender.

These particular designed aspects of Terraria, ones which expect you to tackle certain problems from the surface? They exist because the limited inventory design encourages players to make the surface their home. Take away the inventory limits, and new players will be far less frequent visitors to the surface. And that will impact how they deal with problems. It will make it harder for them to solve certain issues if they don't see the surface as a natural place.

Yes, players who've been playing the game for years will have no problems with dealing with an infinite inventory. They know how the bosses work and how the game flows, and they have all the knowledge needed to manipulate it as they see fit.

The people who will be negatively affected are the ones who have no experience or knowledge in playing the game.

So if the current game were to be adjusted to allow for infinite inventory, maybe it should be something that drops from an enemy in the world. Maybe it could be a reward for beating Master Mode Moon Lord (though that's a bit extreme, but it would definitely get me to play Master Mode...). That way, the process of getting new players to understand the game won't be affected.
Why is this so long?
 

Terra M Welch

Duke Fishron
I guess I ought to chip off the rust at some point huh? Been forever since I played Terraria.
Perhaps 1.4 might rekindle my burnt out spirit on this game.
 

Olegrizz90

Skeletron Prime
Terraria = my home away from home......my second life even if it's an artificial one :)...........thank you for creating such a beautifully made game
 

Gustone

Eye of Cthulhu
if this is journeys end then after that the modders wouldnt have to bother about their mods being outdated
 
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