Stardust Summons: Dragon vs. Cells?

coffeemancer

Terrarian
So, if I have Minion Count 3 (Basic one + Bewitching buff + Potion), what situations would be good to slot one in over the other?

Particularly interested (and maybe the only relevant situation left...), what is best for Moon Lord?

And... for you poor Summoners actually using the Summoner gear... which one is best when you have full minion count + DPS ?
 
When I'm messing around with Stardust armor, I honestly find that I prefer a legion of Star Cells. Those things will teleport all over the place, leaving little infected cells on things that do 10 DMG every second for on how many they've put on it that (they can put more than one) ignores defense, or otherwise ram into them. Often they'll kill something you can't even see from all directions. During the Lunar Event you often won't even see them because they'll be teleporting, ramming, and infecting things nonstop.

However, I have found that the Stardust Dragon works better on the Moon Lord specifically. The problem with Star Cells comes from the fact that when he closes his eyes, the infected cells they've stuck to him do nothing. The Stardust Dragon will eventually just hurt him anyway since it will be all over him, but it's a major waste of time with Star Cells.
 
Actually is Summoner gear raelly good for end game content?
On top of the Star Cell and Stardust Dragon Staffs, there is also the Moon Lord drops Lunar Portal and Rainbow Crystal Staff. Those are sentry minions, so you can only have one out and move it around, but you can use as many sentries as you like. The Lunar Portal sends out a huge sweeping laser beam much like the Moon Lord, but it seems weaker than the Rainbow Crystal. In reality, the Rainbow Crystal works differently - shooting a bunch of little beams that end in delayed explosions. The explosions are the only things that do damage. Even though it does more damage, there are enemies that can avoid being hurt by it at all. On the other hand the Lunar Portal will hit anything that doesn't go through walls. You can use both at the same time so it doesn't matter all that much, and on top of that you can also use the Frost Hydra. So you'll have all 3 of them somewhere on the screen ruining the Lunar Pillars day, for example.

Also, if you're going to be a summoner you need to remember this important thing for your minion staffs if you didn't already know - Mythical is worthless to them. Most of those bonuses do not apply to the actual minion at all. Ruthless is actually the best you can give your minions.

Then we get to the Stardust Guardian. This guy is a bit weird. You double tap down and he goes to where your cursor is and does clapping explosions to enemies that go near it, which doesn't actually do much damage. It's apparently supposed to draw aggro or something.
 
Personally, I love them both. And since you're going to be grinding pillars anyway, you might as well put some stardust fragments into both. They both have features that make them really interesting and useful for a variety of situations.

~STARDUST DRAGON~
+ Can :red:ing FLY THROUGH WALLS AND KILL ANYONE. ANYWHERE. ANYTIME.
+ Can do insane amounts of DPS, even without making him incredibly large.
+ Because of this, as well as single-target focus, Stardust Dragon can be brutal against bosses and certain tough enemies.
- Can only target one enemy at a time, since he's a singular entity.
- Because he can fly through walls, he can frequently get distracted trying to kill enemies that otherwise are a non-issue. You don't need him to kill that enemy trapped down in the cave hidden under your spawn. You need him up here fighting the Martian Saucer, dammit.

~STARDUST CELL~
- Cannot fly through walls or target enemies through walls.
+ Can target multiple enemies due to being multiple separate minions.
+ Fire additional shots at enemies the Summoner (or his Stardust Guardian) is attacking at times.
+ Because they can't attack or target enemies through walls, they won't get distracted like the Dragon, and will only target enemies that are a direct threat to the Summoner. This is a pretty big plus in my opinion.
+ Stardust Cell projectile attacks leave a mini-cell latched onto the target that deals an ongoing 10 damage per tick. Stardust Cells can stack additional mini-cells on the target, raising the damage per tick by 10 for each additional cell. Mini-cells tick 30 times before vanishing. There appears to be no limit to how many mini-cells can be stacked onto a single target, although the firing rate is a self-imposed limit.

Then we get to the Stardust Guardian. This guy is a bit weird. You double tap down and he goes to where your cursor is and does clapping explosions to enemies that go near it, which doesn't actually do much damage. It's apparently supposed to draw aggro or something.
The aggro draw is actually pretty good but not gauranteed.
 
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The biggest problem I have with this class is that you need to get close enough to enemies to make your minions aggro on them and can't run far enough away to make them return to you in really hectic situations. In addition your minions don't really have the DPS that the mage or the ranger can bring to the table. With your own weapons added, you're about on even footing, but you're down 30+ armor points. I feel like the armor should provide protection about on par with the ranger class, if not a little more. The Stardust Guardian in his current state is weaksauce as well; his damage is nearly nonexistent; the aggro draw seems really inconsistent too.
 
>enters thread
>skims
>summoners being called weak
>oh god my sides

I dunno about you guys but like, 400 damage constantly ticking away at things (dragon) or a group of like 7 cells constantly gangbanging stuff for 70-ish a hit + a stackable DoT isn't weak. As a matter of fact, take these absurd damage potentials and add absolute, perfect autoaim accuracy onto it and you have a class whose only weakness is low defense, which barely matters anyway.
 
When you have only one summon/part, the Dragon is better of overall in the DPS department.

When it comes down in a Summoner setup, the Cells teleporting and DoT are far better than the Dragon in most situations.
 
>enters thread
>skims
>summoners being called weak
>oh god my sides

I dunno about you guys but like, 400 damage constantly ticking away at things (dragon) or a group of like 7 cells constantly gangbanging stuff for 70-ish a hit + a stackable DoT isn't weak. As a matter of fact, take these absurd damage potentials and add absolute, perfect autoaim accuracy onto it and you have a class whose only weakness is low defense, which barely matters anyway.
Stardust Cells are just plain :red:ing NUTS man. I LOVE them. Hadda expand the wiki article about them so erryone could see how badass they really are.
 
>enters thread
>skims
>summoners being called weak
>oh god my sides

I dunno about you guys but like, 400 damage constantly ticking away at things (dragon) or a group of like 7 cells constantly gangbanging stuff for 70-ish a hit + a stackable DoT isn't weak. As a matter of fact, take these absurd damage potentials and add absolute, perfect autoaim accuracy onto it and you have a class whose only weakness is low defense, which barely matters anyway.

What's your accessory setup? I filled mine with as many +minion as I could and I wasn't doing as well as I could have been on any other class. Is there a balance between conventional accessories/+damage and +minion to be hard? The cells and dragon seem wonderful, but all of the other summons leading up to it throughout the game suffer from derptastic AI (minus the UFO one allegedly; I don't own it yet).
 
Avenger Emblem, Papyrus Scarab, and general accessories beyond that. You know, wings, celestial shell, philosopher's stone/whatever. Spooky Armor

It should always be noted that summoners are doing it wrong if they don't use conventional weapons themselves. Daybreak is an AWESOME accompany to a summoner, as is a gun of some type.
 
I've been using Last Prism as my backup weapon simply for how fast it hits, trying to maximize the proc rate on the Stardust Cells. I'll have to give your loadout a try; I was using Papyrus Scarab + Necromantic Scroll + Beetle, so that may explain why I've been having trouble.
 
Avenger Emblem, Papyrus Scarab, and general accessories beyond that. You know, wings, celestial shell, philosopher's stone/whatever. Spooky Armor

It should always be noted that summoners are doing it wrong if they don't use conventional weapons themselves. Daybreak is an AWESOME accompany to a summoner, as is a gun of some type.
I usually prefer Vortex Beater and a Solar Eruption. Especially if I'm runnin' Cells.

Mothron wants to cling to me in my own home? Come at me bro.
 
On top of the Star Cell and Stardust Dragon Staffs, there is also the Moon Lord drops Lunar Portal and Rainbow Crystal Staff. Those are sentry minions, so you can only have one out and move it around, but you can use as many sentries as you like. The Lunar Portal sends out a huge sweeping laser beam much like the Moon Lord, but it seems weaker than the Rainbow Crystal. In reality, the Rainbow Crystal works differently - shooting a bunch of little beams that end in delayed explosions. The explosions are the only things that do damage. Even though it does more damage, there are enemies that can avoid being hurt by it at all. On the other hand the Lunar Portal will hit anything that doesn't go through walls. You can use both at the same time so it doesn't matter all that much, and on top of that you can also use the Frost Hydra. So you'll have all 3 of them somewhere on the screen ruining the Lunar Pillars day, for example.

Also, if you're going to be a summoner you need to remember this important thing for your minion staffs if you didn't already know - Mythical is worthless to them. Most of those bonuses do not apply to the actual minion at all. Ruthless is actually the best you can give your minions.

Then we get to the Stardust Guardian. This guy is a bit weird. You double tap down and he goes to where your cursor is and does clapping explosions to enemies that go near it, which doesn't actually do much damage. It's apparently supposed to draw aggro or something.

I can confirm that the Guardian has done his job well

He protected me from a blue slime. Well done.
 
"
you have a class whose only weakness is low defense, which barely matters anyway.
"

When you're at that end game power-level yeah, except I still can't beat Moon Lord with a summoner load out. Dodging some of the dislodged eyeball attacks 3 at a time seems downright impossible, having the extra defense is critical or i don't kill the heart in time

Maybe i can dodge everythign iwth the broken as :red: UFO now, but i haven't tried yet

I will say that Stardust Dragon at full power Spooky Armor melts the :red: out of the cultist, the fastest I've ever killed Cultist. I don't know why that doesn't translate over to Moon Lord's heart... probably because while I'm moving and trying to dodge IMPENDING DOOM the dragon has to catch up as the heart moves with me. But the Cultist stands still alot
 
Well, it depends on what you're against.

If you're up against a swarm of enemies, or an event, I would use the Dragon, so you can increase the dragon's length and stack more damage on your enemies. You can use the cells if you wish, but they don't really penetrate through multiple enemies like the dragon

If you're up against a boss or a VERY VERY tough enemy, use the cells. Having multiple of them adds more DPS per second, which will take down the boss/enemy very quickly. Of course, you can use the dragon, but it'll have to charge into the enemy again after an attack, instead of shooting stuff that'll latch and deal damage onto the enemy
 
you know what? my summoning build (Vordren the overseer) has 11 total minions, and so i like to use BOTH! i make my dragon short and have a small platoon of orbs. the dragon can go through walls, and on first look seems to travel much faster- the orbs are like a plague-bouncing around in front of my, latching on leaving bits of themselves behind as a dot. its a beautiful thing. i think they are made to work in tandem. the dragon has pierce which give him advantages over large enemies, but less effective against enemies who get invulnerability after being hit (moon lord) or have ridiculous defense (what good is a 3 segment dragon if they only hit for like 11 dmg each)

Capture 2015-08-08 11_02_24.png

thats where the cells balance it out- they don't get distracted like the dragon so the tend to go after more imminent threats, they target multiple targets and leave behind dots- so even if they are out numbered they are still hurting everything around them.

it seems to me like the dragon chases down shadows while my cells fill out the room, if theres an enemy they have difficulty wearing down- the stardust dragon zips right through them to finish them off.

stardust guardian- i haven't been able to test him out because i ALWAYS forget to deploy him during tough times, and i always forget to pay attention after i send him out. fun fact, dye in your pet slot will change his color, and some dyes can be really amazing.

Capture 2015-08-04 20_54_39.png Capture 2015-08-02 19_05_09.png Capture 2015-08-02 18_38_48.png

the sad part about end game is- whats the point in grinding when you already have everything you want? so my end game builds are not min maxed out for DPS, and i cant back up my claims with numbers, but i recommend trying out both of them- if your limit is 3, make one dragon and two cells, if you've got a summoner build, with 9 minions- try a three piece dragon and 6 cells. hell go for a summoner combo meal- 2 piece stardust dragon, a trio of cells, two deadly sphere staffs and a pirate! it offers a lot of versatility because each minion has its own AI and covers the area in a unique way. i also just love having a lonely pirate with me
 
Having multiple of them adds more DPS per second
Theres no such thing as a DPS per second :D

I think the Stardust Dragon is better. The one,single minion itself with no damage modifiers will do 240 DPS- that's more than Megashark's DPS. With 10 minions with deafult damage the DPS will be over 2000- more than Lunar Flare. And the Summonner have the biggest +%Damage of the game.
 
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