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Suggestion Forum Rule Amendments Open Discussion (Jan 11th)

Leinfors

Quality Assurance
Staff member
Moderator
Re-Logic
Hey there folks, you are probably here to discuss these rules amendments here: http://forums.terraria.org/index.ph...n-forum-behavior-effective-january-20th.9304/

If not, I would suggest you read them before commenting, but once you have, feel free to discuss it here!

Because these rules apply less to a "set of actions" and more to the unfriendly spirit of posting in the Suggestion section, it is impossible to define it exactly. To that end, we want EVERYONE to have time to get a feel for what is okay to post and say in that section . . . you can post those questions, or any comments or concerns you have here. We would rather have people ask if certain things are okay, rather than just assume they are and be incorrect.

I'll try to respond as best I can as often as I can!
 
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Tsuki

Party Girl
Pretty good set of rules, covered almost all of the bases, I'd think. I'm all in favor of the constructive criticism attitude, myself, and less about bashing the heads in of people who may or may not have "good" suggestions or "not in as much detail as we'd like." It's like "great, you identified a suggestion as bad and called it bad and now the OP is so discouraged he probably won't post another suggestion. Congratulations." But what really does that accomplish? A bad suggestion wouldn't be implemented anyway, and they did nothing to help the bad suggestion get better. In the end, nothing was really gained by either party. Other than boosting someone's ego if they fancy themselves better than "Bad suggestion OP" at making suggestions.

That being said, I do have one concern (That isn't even native to this forum but a problem in almost all forums that have suggestions.) I call it "Drive-by." When Person A makes a suggestion, and Person B made a similar suggestion prior. Person B comes into Person A's thread offering nothing other than "This has been done before," posts a link, and then offers literally nothing else to the conversation. How are situations like this going to be treated? Should the person that makes a suggestion first have "100% royalty" over the idea and be allowed to advertise his own thread in other people's suggestions? The best ideas come from people working together on an idea, not one person thinking his ideas are better than other people's.

So I guess the question I'm asking, would be "Will it be against the rules for people to offer nothing else to someone's suggestion thread that they worked hard on, other than "this is just a copy of X and it's better thought out"?" I don't think it'd be entirely fair to "Person A" in this scenario who may have a different take on the same idea, but it's an issue that is pretty common on a lot of suggestion forums. Nor do I think it's a completely intelligent way to go about suggestions to begin with. Especially in certain suggestions that a ton of people like, but can be translated into entirely different implementations. I don't think it'd be an issue if Person B wanted to work with Person A and exchange ideas, but Person B is providing nothing of worth to Person A's thread other than "I have a similar idea and I think mine is better." In the end, it's not about who has the best ideas, who has the most ideas, whose ideas are the most famous. In the end, it's things that the community wants in the game, and trying to convince the devs to add it. It doesn't have to be "My" suggestion that got into the game. With enough community input and collaboration, with enough exchange of ideas, with enough different opinions on balance, it becomes "our" suggestion that got into the game.

So, TLDR (And up for discussion, I suppose): Duplicate Suggestions and "advertising" your suggestion in other, similar suggestions because they are a similar destination, so to speak, with a different path taken.
 

Pixel

Terrarian
Sounds great. I was a little concerned about the use of "unoriginal". Though I do use it often, I tend to use it in a nice and not so much of a hard hitting manner. Well done for the new rules, hope things will start getting better around here.
 

Leinfors

Quality Assurance
Staff member
Moderator
Re-Logic
Keep in mind, the rules haven't been set in stone, and additions are welcome if we can find good things to specifically mention in them.

Duplicate suggestions are something we have different methods of dealing with, depending on the situation. For instance, literally identical suggestions will usually not be kept around . . . say, if two people each make topics proposing the exact same item with the exact same implementation. We would normally favor the original poster. There are some exceptions here though:

1. If someone has a megathread which includes a concept, and then someone makes a specific thread devoted to that concept. An example of this is that SzGamer has an interesting thread dedicated to creating a multitude of new bullet types, including but not limited to Tungsten bullets. Later on it came to our attention that other people were creating dedicated "Tungsten bullet" threads. We felt that due to the extra attention being given to JUST that bullet type, they deserved their own thread, as a megathread doesn't quite provide the same dedicated attention. Similarly, if two people each have megathreads full of many suggestions, we aren't going to be locking anything based on one or two duplicates.

2. There are a few concepts out there that are SO often suggested, sometimes with so many variations, that we've decided to let them go. The most well known example of this are the multitude of "Terra Boots" proposals (any variation of Lava Waders + Frostspark Boots tinkers). If we were to lock all but the earliest suggestion of this, we'd be locking two or three dozen topics all the way back to TO . . . which just isn't practical. As a result, we let people have their own takes on it.

3. When people have similar ideas that have unique implementation. We normally will let the alternate variation stand, because its the variation that makes these different concepts unique. If we locked all but the "first" proposal of something like this, we'd be stamping out opportunity for creativity and original designs.

So what does that have to do with your point of duplicates? Well, if the suggestion IS truly a duplicate that we would be inclined to close, posting a link to the original thread is fine . . . but if all you are doing is pointing out your own variation with a curt "this has already been done", we'd rather you not. We would MUCH rather you report the thread as a duplicate with the original thread linked in the report, so we can make the call. If the thread is a real duplicate, we will likely lock it and provide the link ourselves. If it is sufficiently unique to leave open, or falls under one of the criteria above, we probably won't act on it. We really don't think "claiming" concepts and then trying to close all variations of that suggestion is a good thing for the suggestions section, so we would rather leave open a near duplicate than close a similar but unique variation (we err on the side of favoring the duplicate, rather than the original).

Too long, didn't read? Short answer is that the safest bet is to report duplicate threads with a link to the original so that we can try to handle it. Posting one suggestion in another is a risky area that can often be seen as advertising, especially if YOU made the original. So be careful about that.

Input Needed: Is this something you guys would like to see briefly covered in this rule amendment? These aren't set in stone. We can add a bit about calling out duplicates and to report and move on instead.

Sounds great. I was a little concerned about the use of "unoriginal". Though I do use it often, I tend to use it in a nice and not so much of a hard hitting manner. Well done for the new rules, hope things will start getting better around here.
My problem with the word is that it doesn't carry much accurate meaning. It is being used to convey "boring or uninspired" but the truth is that it is usually describing topics that "it was interesting the first time I read it, but this is the 10th time I've read it". The inherent problem with that is that it usually IS a good suggestion that is just so obvious (Terra Boots, for instance) that it is independently invented dozens of times . . . does that make it unoriginal? I don't think it does. To the person suggesting the 50th rendition of the Terra Boots, it could be the first time they've seen such a thing. To them it is novel and intriguing. Telling them its unoriginal isn't going to explain much to them, because they just won't get it.

It is also thrown out a lot to describe suggestions which are crudely implemented or "overpowered", such as insanely powerful "True Terra Blades" and the like. There is nothing unoriginal about that, it is, in fact, a logical progression of the "True" series of weapons, which is why so many people come up with it. Does that make it unoriginal? Sure, it means 100 people already came up with idea, but what does telling people that help? Focus more on the legitimate flaws of the suggestion, not the fact that its been done before . . . after all, the 100th variation might be the best one.
 
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Having read over the amendments, I can appreciate the restrictions being set in place here. More specifically, I have a few suggestion threads floating around in there. As do you, Lein. I definitely get a lot more out of constructive criticism than when someone says "No" or "This is bad and you should feel bad" as their reason for disliking the suggestion. So cutting down on those sorts of responses is a plus.
 

Leinfors

Quality Assurance
Staff member
Moderator
Re-Logic
I definitely get a lot more out of constructive criticism than when someone says "No" or "This is bad and you should feel bad" as their reason for disliking the suggestion. So cutting down on those sorts of responses is a plus.
This is exactly what we are trying to do. That second one is a great example of the "meme-like" negative responses we've been seeing. It doesn't help anybody at all.
 

Daimera

Terrarian
This sounds fantastic, though the whole discussion about not locking repetitive threads for not being exact duplicates does kind of feel like an overall brushing aside of the "please look around to make sure your idea hasn't been suggested before" rule, especially suggestions that almost always get negative responses historically (True Terra Blade, I am looking at you).

If people followed that rule and actually looked to see if their idea has been done and actually took efforts to see what people dislike about 'overdone' suggestions to make sure they avoid the trappings that draw so much ire, a lot of bile could be avoided, but it seems people, especially new members, constantly ignore it... "after all, the 100th variation might be the best one" seems silly in the light of the fact that many times these overused ideas are almost never brought back up with anything of value relative to the other 99. If streamlining these to a single thread for discussion were enforced, maybe people could hammer out one good (or at least passable) suggestion instead of 99 individual bad ones and then one good one. Perhaps there should be dedicated, stickied discussion threads for oversuggested assets, rather than just letting countless half-thought versions of the same concept float around?

Overall, this does just seem to be a rehashing of existing "be nice to people" rules, without actually harping on people who don't follow the "try to make a good suggestion" rules. :\
 

Leinfors

Quality Assurance
Staff member
Moderator
Re-Logic
Overall, this does just seem to be a rehashing of existing "be nice to people" rules, without actually harping on people who don't follow the "try to make a good suggestion" rules. :\
I'll be honest; as moderators for this forum, our priority is respectful posting, rather than "players designing the best possible suggestions for the game". Ultimately, the suggestions folder offers only a small number of actual suggestions to the game, with the vast majority being little more than a thought exercise for dedicated Terraria players.

Believe me, I'm all for optimizing the process, but right now the bigger issue is a seriously toxic atmosphere of rudeness and meanness. Finding the ultimate True Terra Blade design is a much, much lower priority.

Keep in mind another thing, which you pointed out: the most common people to make this poorly designed duplicate suggestions are newer members. We all know that most people just click through "rules" when they join a forum, and its the ones who stick around that eventually figure them out. While not reading them is no excuse, I'm not surprised at all when a new member doesn't understand the complexities and years word of history the Suggestions forum has, and it is NOT easy to quickly wrap one's mind around.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that new members have an excuse to be making low quality suggestions. The veteran members who post constantly do NOT have an excuse to be posting they way they are though, and that is the more serious issue. Making some new rules about proper suggestion making isn't going to have a profound impact on the way newer members are posting, because it is something that takes time to learn. And the mean-spiritedness I've seen in threads chases these newer players away, rather than giving them time to learn and understand the intricacies of making good suggestions.

especially suggestions that almost always get negative responses historically (True Terra Blade, I am looking at you).
That strikes me as an issue with the community, rather than the idea, no? People have a negative knee-jerk reaction every time they see TTB topics, and they barge in with their "nopenopenopes" and "you should feel bads" without even giving it a chance. Once we deal with that, I'd be glad to move on to expanding on the issue of duplicate suggestions and "newbie suggestors", which really do need some sort of training ground to cut their teeth on, I think, though I have no idea how to implement it.
 
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Daimera

Terrarian
It's less about the actual end-goal of getting better suggestions, and more an observation of the causality behind a lot of the negativity. If people followed the rules about making better suggestions, they'd get less negativity. Why not enforce those rules and/or provide alternative recourse for consistent problem-causers whenever possible?

Cthulhu suggestions are already banned, perhaps not for this reason specifically, but clearly for a reason. Why not dig around, find the most common problem threads, and then go "Okay, here's a discussion thread for this suggestion, please do not make a new thread about it." That way, if someone ignores the rules and makes a thread, it'll be a simple matter of "Hey, there's a dedicated thread for this, go there" instead of having to question "Is this similar enough to the others to be considered a duplicate or not...?"

It doesn't solve the entire problem, but it does take out some of the repeat offenders.

Edit: And just in case people misunderstand me, I'm NOT saying that being a jerk is okay because these people are breaking rules. Being a jerk is NOT okay and I'm totally fine with these 'new' rules.

The way this looks to me is children arguing on the playground, with a bunch of bigger, meaner ones ganging up on one, and the adult comes by and pulls the group off to the side and scolds them for being mean but doesn't check to see if the other did something wrong, too. Yes, the group of mean kids needs to be handled with much more immediacy, and I'm not saying the suggesters need to be punished per-se, I just think that there should be some effort put into making sure the other party also receives some form of education on the matter, and that said education is distributed more effectively to newcomers down the road.
 
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Leinfors

Quality Assurance
Staff member
Moderator
Re-Logic
It's less about the actual end-goal of getting better suggestions, and more an observation of the causality behind a lot of the negativity. If people followed the rules about making better suggestions, they'd get less negativity. Why not enforce those rules and/or provide alternative recourse for consistent problem-causers whenever possible?
Thing is, there is no excuse for the disrespectful behavior no matter what the cause. I'm not disagreeing that what you are proposing could be a good idea in some capacity, but making bad and/or duplicate suggestions is one problem, the resulting behavior is another, and a far more concerning one. That is what we are addressing at this time. We can fix the fundamental issue of poor suggestion quality later, but there is no excuse at all for the behavior we are seeing in response to it. Its actually just about the most toxic place on these forums right now.

The other thing is, I don't think the problem threads are that easily isolated. Sure, full body Cthulhus, Mechanical BoC, and True Terra Blades are an issue, but for everyone one of those, you see someone making an entirely original, if poorly designed invasion, or biome, or weapon, that gets completely derailed. I don't think the issue lies isolated in a handful of thread types. The full body Cthulhu one is also partly based on direct feedback from Redigit himself, so that is why it stands alone as a specific example.
 

darthmorf

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
The only thing I wish was that the forum would search itself for keywords in the title, and offer a list of threads that might be unintentional duplicates. But that'd be hard to code. Overall I have seen a lot less flame war here than TO, and I hope it stays positive like this.
 

Axios

The Destroyer
I first started on TO and got my :red: jumped when I made a dupe thread or an unoriginal idea. But now new guys get special treatment? Why? The suggestions are there to read and get ideas. If they can't read them and understand what's original or too OP then that's on them. I understand not being rude to them but they don't need special treatment.

Also, "if there exactly the same well lock the dupe". Then go ahead and unlock a lot of the threads. " exact dupe" shouldn't be a requirement.

Also may I message you?
 

Leinfors

Quality Assurance
Staff member
Moderator
Re-Logic
I first started on TO and got my :red: jumped when I made a dupe thread or an unoriginal idea. But now new guys get special treatment? Why?
Its not special treatment. Its a team decision that the behavior in the Suggestions section is unacceptable given our standards and expectations for posters on this website. This is far, far less about suggestions and much more about the posting quality that happens to be in the suggestion section.

The suggestions are there to read and get ideas. If they can't read them and understand what's original or too OP then that's on them. I understand not being rude to them but they don't need special treatment.?
Again, not special treatment. Personal attacks of the like we are seeing are unwelcome anywhere on these forums, but they are showing up much more often in this section than any other. Do I expect you to coddle new posters? Not at all, you can ignore them, you can express dissatisfaction with their posts, you can try to help critique it, all of these are fine. But they aren't allowed to "get their :red: jumped" as you say.

Also, "if there exactly the same well lock the dupe". Then go ahead and unlock a lot of the threads. " exact dupe" shouldn't be a requirement.

Also may I message you?
There are other reasons for locking threads, but if you have a list of locked threads which you believe should be unlocked due to being unique enough, let me know . . . our policy has shifted slightly in the four months since the site came out.

And of course, you can PM me. :)
 

Dakota Spine

Headless Horseman
I am glad to see these rules taking hold. There honestly isn't much else for me to say, I am just glad some rules are being laid down.
 

Gotcha!

Pumpking
Although I agree with most of the rules, I do hope criticizers are not supposed to pamper suggestion makers from now on.
I'm against rudeness and hostility, but some people already consider my criticism rude/hostile sometimes while I just consider it very direct. I don't want to insult someone with a bad idea, but I don't want to sugarcoat my opinion either.

I hope I (and others) won't be punished for not pampering someone who makes a poor suggestion. Sure, there's no need to be an arsehole, but being overly nice isn't going to help the suggestion maker in improving his suggestions either, in my ever so humble opinion.

Oh well, I'll see how this works out I guess.
 

Kazzymodus

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Although I agree with most of the rules, I do hope criticizers are not supposed to pamper suggestion makers from now on.
I'm against rudeness and hostility, but some people already consider my criticism rude/hostile sometimes while I just consider it very direct. I don't want to insult someone with a bad idea, but I don't want to sugarcoat my opinion either.

I hope I (and others) won't be punished for not pampering someone who makes a poor suggestion. Sure, there's no need to be an arsehole, but being overly nice isn't going to help the suggestion maker in improving his suggestions either, in my ever so humble opinion.

Oh well, I'll see how this works out I guess.
If people take criticism personally (and some people on the forums do), then anything you say is considered insulting by them. If you're not attacking the poster and explain your opinion, you're fine, regardless of what the poster thinks.

My problem with the word is that it doesn't carry much accurate meaning. It is being used to convey "boring or uninspired" but the truth is that it is usually describing topics that "it was interesting the first time I read it, but this is the 10th time I've read it". The inherent problem with that is that it usually IS a good suggestion that is just so obvious (Terra Boots, for instance) that it is independently invented dozens of times . . . does that make it unoriginal? I don't think it does. To the person suggesting the 50th rendition of the Terra Boots, it could be the first time they've seen such a thing. To them it is novel and intriguing. Telling them its unoriginal isn't going to explain much to them, because they just won't get it.

It is also thrown out a lot to describe suggestions which are crudely implemented or "overpowered", such as insanely powerful "True Terra Blades" and the like. There is nothing unoriginal about that, it is, in fact, a logical progression of the "True" series of weapons, which is why so many people come up with it. Does that make it unoriginal? Sure, it means 100 people already came up with idea, but what does telling people that help? Focus more on the legitimate flaws of the suggestion, not the fact that its been done before . . . after all, the 100th variation might be the best one.
I personally use the word "unoriginal" to indicate suggestions that are already in-game things with very little uniqueness to them. Is that an acceptable use of the word or do I have to rely on litotes (not innovative) to get that across?
 
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Loki

Consigliere
Staff member
Re-Logic
Administrator
A few random thoughts on reading the comments:

Daimera is correct that some suggestions could be better or less repetitive. Lein is equally correct that this is a problem that needs come AFTER the cleaning up of the toxicity.

This isn't about someone over-reacting to legit, respectfully-given critique (we see that and can easily parse it out). It's about the other stuff. Anyone whom frequents the suggestion area knows what I mean. It's wholly unnecessary to toss snark or be a rude :red: - valid critique or no. Doing so improves nothing - not the idea, not the community, not either poster - nothing. This is an extension of the culture - as all the rules are.

Being negative and being respectful and not mutually exclusive. That's the point. Being negative respectfully implies a constructive intent - the inverse implies the opposite.

Lein's point on new members was just an example - not an attempt to say that newbies have one set of rules.

The only thing I wish was that the forum would search itself for keywords in the title, and offer a list of threads that might be unintentional duplicates. But that'd be hard to code. Overall I have seen a lot less flame war here than TO, and I hope it stays positive like this.
This is actually possible - and something we nearly did - but there are serious concerns on the technical side in regards to server load and lag on a forum this size. We don't want to destroy the overall forum experience...but I'll continue to see if it could exist in a more isolated format.



This is Lein's show - but thought I'd give my perspective. :)
 

Tsuki

Party Girl
The issue being described here is kind of the problem itself. People feel like it's up to them to talk about which suggestions are bad, which suggestions are worth locking, which suggestions are "half-thought out" and who's "not trying to make a good suggestion." I don't exactly think it fair to immediately discount someone's suggestion as "they didn't put any thought into it, it's a bad suggestion, try to make better suggestions, etc." And when that sort of mentality is reflected in how a user posts, that itself is creating toxicity that could be avoided. Who determines whether or not someone is following the "rule about making better suggestions?" The staff, right? Well, maybe if people reported a topic that was done "100 times before," it'd achieve more than people going into the thread 100 times to say it's been done before.

A lot of the issue is ultimately caused by people going into other people's suggestion threads and trashing them for one reason or another. What is being described right now is just another one of those reasons. I'd rather see crappy suggestions than crappy behavior, and people being unnecessarily crappy to other people. Rather than going into someone's thread for whatever reason to insult their idea as something that's "been done before so many times beating the dead horse blah blah," if people were a bit more helpful, approachable, and willing to offer constructive criticism, this wouldn't even be an issue. And if the ultimate goal of the suggestions forums is to get something into the game, I'm sure the devs will be able to see that a suggestion isn't "worth putting in."

But the current approach of being crappy to each other isn't going to help anyone. It's not going to help the devs, the staff, your good suggestion, or their bad suggestion. It helps nobody. The option exists to report a suggestion that's been overdone. (No, not "overdone" as in 5 times, but if it were truly done 50-100 times) The option exists to ignore a suggestion that's been over done. The option exists to try and collaborate with each other to take the good parts of each suggestion thread into the best possible version of itself. And finally, the option exists to go in there and trash it. We're here because too many people are making the wrong choice. It's sad. It's not even like it's "What's your favorite music in Terraria" we're talking about. True Terra Blade is a pretty crappy example, because the current progression of swords in Terraria leaves more than enough reasoning that there should be a "True Terra Blade." People are going to have their own take on it. The "good ones" rise to the top, and the "bad ones" don't. But people acting like they're the suggestion police is not really helping. That forum is for more than just the "suggestion talented" people.

If people want to treat "duplicate" suggestion threads in the same way we treat other duplicate threads, appropriate recourse would be reporting it and ignoring it anyway. Not some kind of vigilante mission to tell them their stuff sucks, or to trash it because all the cool kids are doing it. Not only does that discourage people, but it harbors a sense of elitism in a section of the forum that should be a free spot for any person to suggest ideas that they feel could improve / add to a game they enjoy.

And no, before anyone even thinks of responding with "We shouldn't be forced to give bad / new suggestions special treatment or baby them." That's not what I'm saying in the least. But the current method that other people are using is not helping in the least. Especially when people slam "True Terra Blade" for being overly suggested, but their only responses are "Omg not this again." If I want to address the "counterargument" that "new members aren't following the rules of searching before they make a suggestion / not trying to make a good suggestion. Yes, that might be breaking the rules. But personal attacks, trolling, and other malicious responses that I've seen are breaking a bigger rule, and more severely at that. So for people that take it upon themselves to be rude and attack an overdone suggestion, they are trying to right a wrong with another wrong. Trying to fix a situation that could be easily remedied, with a solution that's not as easy to handle. Nobody benefits from it.

The issue isn't that people are taking constructive criticism too hard, or taking it to close to heart. The issue is that some people are massively overreacting about suggestions that have been done / overdone / beaten to death. Great. True Terra Blade has been suggested 100 times. But you know what? The people that suggested it the 100th time only made one mistake: Not searching for similar ideas before they posted. And they were met with hostility from people who were sick of the previous 99 times it was mentioned. And trolling. This person didn't search the suggestion forums for Terra Blade, so he doesn't even know how overdone it was. And people trash the thread for him not knowing it? People doing the trashing know better. And they know that they know better.

So in short, the issue isn't about babying, or giving special treatment, or pampering. The people that give honest criticism, and the people that try to help know who they are. The people that are doing the trashing, poking fun at people, and being nothing but hostile also know who they are. The issue is people are being rude to their fellow Terrarian for an issue that's easily remedied, and exacerbating the problem more than a duplicate thread ever could.

Edit: Seeing my point is as easy as searching for "True Terra Blade" yourselves and seeing just how rude people can be to each other. I think I just might make a compilation.
 
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Leinfors

Quality Assurance
Staff member
Moderator
Re-Logic
I'm against rudeness and hostility, but some people already consider my criticism rude/hostile sometimes while I just consider it very direct. I don't want to insult someone with a bad idea, but I don't want to sugarcoat my opinion either.
This won't be a problem. We know the difference between constructive criticism and insults. You know those comments, where someone gives good feedback and the suggestion creator is like "stop being mean"? They report that stuff sometimes, and we reject it. Truly constructive criticism doesn't have a hostile feeling to it, and we can see that in a post, even if sensitive suggestors can't. Heck, we've even taken action against suggestors who get too upset and THEY end up acting out in response to valid critique.

I hope I (and others) won't be punished for not pampering someone who makes a poor suggestion. Sure, there's no need to be an arsehole, but being overly nice isn't going to help the suggestion maker in improving his suggestions either, in my ever so humble opinion.
Not so much about being nice, but not being mean. Being professional. And there is always a SUPER simple solution when you aren't sure: don't post at all. No one has any obligation to comment on any suggestion ever. You can't ever get in trouble for not posting in a thread.

I personally use the word "unoriginal" to indicate suggestions that are already in-game things with very little uniqueness to them. Is that an acceptable use of the word or do I have to rely on litotes (not innovative) to get that across?
I'm not prepared to set down a ground rule on that at this exact time, but if I were in that situation? I'd say that the suggestion didn't provide anything to the game that wasn't already in it, or didn't provide a substantial amount of content for the work needed to implement it. Those are the words I would use, as an example.
 

Thee Pie Man

Official Terrarian
First I'd like to throw a big thank you for all the Moderation staff and everyone that makes these kind of changes possible, and enforces this kind of rule that makes the environment a friendlier place; for the last few months I've been on this forum and enjoying myself; only running into a couple of instances where I myself felt looked down on by the community; and a select slew of others that I felt bad for the original topic creator. I don't think anyone should feel bad about the ideas they come up with; much less so even if they are similar to someone else's idea as aforementioned in the new overview. Things that seem to click into the game but are being redone over and over should have a place here if they are truly brandishing it as a new idea and trying to work out the kinks. The concept can surely stay the same but the idea should have a more redefining air and with these rules I think more people will be likely to post their ideas as well as feel welcome to do so!

I feel like one of the most important things that face this forum is the way each and everyone of us handles' themselves and treats each other. How much tact is used and being professional in feedback and the like. I have posted several times on a couple of threads trying to give people encouragement due to the negativity that their idea got simply because people DIDN'T LIKE IT. They gave no further reason other than distaste; the creativity of this forum is so high and prosperous yet people only reply with things like "unoriginal" as was mentioned and "Dumb idea" etc; I am very glad that this kind of thing is being taken into effect. I really do appreciate everyone that made it possible. I didn't find too much to add to the rules honestly so this is where I take my leave~

I hope everyone has a wonderful day, and thanks once more to our awesome community.
 
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