tModLoader Calamity Mod

[GoldenReady]

OK, sorry if I'm just blind as a bat, but is there any way to donate, and if so, how? Calamity is an excellent piece of work and I would love to give a bit of support to it beyond just a banner. If I just missed it, sorry for being blind.

 

[Shahar]

OK, sorry if I'm just blind as a bat, but is there any way to donate, and if so, how? Calamity is an excellent piece of work and I would love to give a bit of support to it beyond just a banner. If I just missed it, sorry for being blind.

I have no idea how to donate could always ask MountainDrew

 

[MinerTurtle45]

I have no idea how to donate could always ask MountainDrew

...That's who he was asking.

 

[Shyguy]

OK, sorry if I'm just blind as a bat, but is there any way to donate, and if so, how? Calamity is an excellent piece of work and I would love to give a bit of support to it beyond just a banner. If I just missed it, sorry for being blind.

I'm pretty sure they don't accept donations, though I don't know why... I would if they allowed it. If I had money. : (

 

[Shadow Flame]

In my opinion this mod has some of the best sprites that i have seen.

 

[Kefke]

Alright, I didn't want to complain without giving it thought, and I know, Drew, that you've said you aren't going to get rid of it, but the "curse" after the Moon Lord...it's just bad game design. I'm going to get a bet rambly here, but bear with me. It's not the idea I have a problem with, it's the execution.

You're punishing the player for making progress. This negative life regen business actively punishes the player. First of all, players are being penalized with what amounts to an ultimatum in the form of game mechanics. Either your build has to boost regen, or you get a time limit on how long you can be out doing things. It's not like Hardmode, where the challenge ramps up to keep pace with the player, either. The enemies don't get any stronger, the player just gets weaker.

When it comes to Hardmode, there's an aspect of reward there. The game gets harder, but there's also new things to discover, and the potential to surpass your old limits. Plus, the old enemies are still around, just as weak as they've ever been, to show you just how powerful you've become when you're able to easily slaughter them without harm. A slime doesn't suddenly become more able to hurt you than it was just a minute ago when you beat the Wall of Flesh, but rather its tougher, bigger cousins show up. So, what I'm really saying, I guess, is buff the enemies rather than nerf the player. Have things that render added regen irrelevant/ineffective, rather than forcing the player to have even more of it. Special enemies, pockets of "miasma" that debuff the player and/or forcibly set the natural healing rate to zero, enemies that can kill without lowering HP (for example, an enemy that damages mana instead of health, and on-hit inflicts a debuff that kills the player if they have no MP)...there are a lot of ways to challenge the player without making them feel like you're just taking away from them. The key is to make it an interesting challenge. To make it something that takes skill to overcome, and more importantly, something that a skilled player can overcome, rather than a chore. Right now, the Moon Lord's curse feels like a chore. You can't avoid being nerfed, and you either build your character around it, or get stuck with a paltry menial task to perform. Neither one takes any skill or effort, it's just a matter of whether you want gear restrictions, or a time limit.

So, yeah, that's my complaint. The curse is boring. It's not a matter of it being unfair, or being too challenging, at all. It's that it's the wrong kind of challenge. It doesn't make the game more fun, and it tests the numbers (raw stats) rather than the skills of the player.

 

[Zeklo]

Looking to finally give this a go, but the 90% next update progress is intimidating. Has it been stuck like that for ages? I'd hate to start up a run for it to update part way through. I've got bad luck like that.

 

[Fabsol]

Life regen and damage reduction ARE bad game design. Not sure what you're talking about but these systems were designed without limits for some reason by the vanilla Terraria devs. These two stats on their own can be blown out of proportion to ridiculous levels and can make the player nearly invincible, modded or not.

It sounds hypocritical to me to state that I'M making bad game design when I'm trying my best to fix the broken mechanics that vanilla Terraria was built on.

I AM nerfing life regen and I already nerfed damage reduction. Did anybody notice the nerf to damage reduction? Nope, at least not from what I've seen.

If you think this tiny change to the vanilla game is bad game design then I can't WAIT to see what you think about the 1.2 update.

 

[CATZSparks]

Looking to finally give this a go, but the 90% next update progress is intimidating. Has it been stuck like that for ages? I'd hate to start up a run for it to update part way through. I've got bad luck like that.

its been at 90% for 3 days...

 

[Zeklo]

its been at 90% for 3 days...

Oh ok, perfect. I'm not familiar with how quick they work, but I think I can start a run without too much worry of a sudden update. Thanks for the info.

 

[Graydee]

Life regen and damage reduction ARE bad game design. Not sure what you're talking about but these systems were designed without limits for some reason by the vanilla Terraria devs. These two stats on their own can be blown out of proportion to ridiculous levels and can make the player nearly invincible, modded or not.

It sounds hypocritical to me to state that I'M making bad game design when I'm trying my best to fix the broken mechanics that vanilla Terraria was built on.

I AM nerfing life regen and I already nerfed damage reduction. Did anybody notice the nerf to damage reduction? Nope, at least not from what I've seen.

If you think this tiny change to the vanilla game is bad game design then I can't WAIT to see what you think about the 1.2 update.

Damage reduction maybe, but life regen is not bad game design. Without it, damage seems more permanent. While this may be good for some, it is clearly not the tone terraria went for. The ridiculously high regen given by SOME items maybe (specifically some modded ones), but life regen is a fine mechanic in itself, and even works at a fine rate in vanilla, even with the golem accessory (which may have been what you were referring to). My feelings about damage reduction are mixed, though.

Hope I didn't come off as rude

 

[Kefke]

Life regen and damage reduction ARE bad game design. Not sure what you're talking about but these systems were designed without limits for some reason by the vanilla Terraria devs.

What? In what universe are they without limits? You can't stack potions infinitely. You don't have infinite equip slots. There's no consumable that permanently raises either, unlimited use or otherwise. There are exactly three placeable items in Vanilla that boost life regen. Two of them restrict movement to a certain area or you lose the buff, and the other (honey) requires you to jump into something that drastically lowers mobility, leaving you open to attack, to gain the buff on a time limit. However, even if you could permanently get all those buffs at once, they are still a fixed value, even in total. It is still very possible to die even with all of them.

The way the game is designed makes sure there are limits. Which means that if there is too much of either, if it is infinitely scaling, it's because you added things to make it so. Right now, though? You're just making excuses for taking the easy way out. You know what the worst part is, though? By your own admission, your way doesn't even work. If it's so negligible that it can easily be countered the way you've claimed, that means that once people are aware of it and bother with the arbitrary restriction, you've only mildly inconvenienced them, not balanced anything - certainly not balanced the "limitless" protection you claim exists.


Rant over, I'm done. I won't get upset or argue it further, but you're right; If the direction you're taking things is, "Give the player OP gear, then penalize them for having it." I probably won't be interested in this mod in the future.

 

[Uncle Danny]

@Kefke What Drew meant are coded limits. Terraria has no coded limits for DR and life regen. They can be, and are in some cases, stacked to extreme amounts by mods. Sure, this would be the mod's fault, but an easy-to-code limit would have stopped this from happening.

What Drew is trying to achieve here is to get rid of these flaws, although some might not be as convenient and/or thought out as others, he tries his best to do so while keeping Calamity unique.

P.S. One thing most people forget is that Drew is one of the few major mod owners who doesn't ask for donations nor accept them, he does this as a hobby alongside his actual job, yet he gets incredible amounts of hate for it. It doesn't feel nice to know a large part of the community dislikes you, and all it is going to do is going to make him angrier to the community, including those who do provide valid criticism or bring it the way you did. At least cut him some slack.

 

[Fabsol]

@Kefke What Drew meant are coded limits. Terraria has no coded limits for DR and life regen. They can be, and are in some cases, stacked to extreme amounts by mods. Sure, this would be the mod's fault, but an easy-to-code limit would have stopped this from happening.

What Drew is trying to achieve here is to get rid of these flaws, although some might not be as convenient and/or thought out as others, he tries his best to do so while keeping Calamity unique.

P.S. One thing most people forget is that Drew is one of the few major mod owners who doesn't ask for donations nor accept them, he does this as a hobby alongside his actual job, yet he gets incredible amounts of hate for it. It doesn't feel nice to know a large part of the community dislikes you, and all it is going to do is going to make him angrier to the community, including those who do provide valid criticism or bring it the way you did. At least cut him some slack.

Thank you for clarifying what should have been obvious.

Good to have people that know how this game works and can back me up.

 

[Kefke]

@Kefke What Drew meant are coded limits. Terraria has no coded limits for DR and life regen. They can be, and are in some cases, stacked to extreme amounts by mods. Sure, this would be the mod's fault, but an easy-to-code limit would have stopped this from happening.

What Drew is trying to achieve here is to get rid of these flaws, although some might not be as convenient and/or thought out as others, he tries his best to do so while keeping Calamity unique.

P.S. One thing most people forget is that Drew is one of the few major mod owners who doesn't ask for donations nor accept them, he does this as a hobby alongside his actual job, yet he gets incredible amounts of hate for it. It doesn't feel nice to know a large part of the community dislikes you, and all it is going to do is going to make him angrier to the community, including those who do provide valid criticism or bring it the way you did. At least cut him some slack.

Okay, okay...I said I was going to drop this, but since you're calling me out by name, let me address this.

I'll start with the key misconception here. I'm not complaining about trying to compensate for power creep. I'm complaining that the method is sloppy and doesn't really work. I'm complaining that it's annoying-hard, not fun-hard. You can balance things without just resorting to taking things away from the player, and changes by addition are always usually better than changes by subtraction.

The thing is, though, I have no problem with the idea of making changes to give OP players a challenge, but there was no need for a hard-coded limit when the mechanics of the game already put a maximum on. Sure, other mods can add to the numbers, but balancing around every other mod out there is an exercise in futility. Someone will always make OP gear or outright cheats. Someone will always make dev items and debug tools accessible. The only consistency you can guarantee is internal, and at best with a few other mods with whom you actively work to maintain compatibility. Outside of that is just chaos and no-man's land.

 

[Fabsol]

My point still stands and I'm not going to budge, sorry. I won't be flat out decreasing life regen in 1.2 like it currently is now, but I WILL be placing a limit on it that will only be active for expert and revengeance.

The damage reduction limit will be in there no matter what in the same form it is right now.

 

[Graydee]

@Kefke
P.S. One thing most people forget is that Drew is one of the few major mod owners who doesn't ask for donations nor accept them, he does this as a hobby alongside his actual job, yet he gets incredible amounts of hate for it. It doesn't feel nice to know a large part of the community dislikes you, and all it is going to do is going to make him angrier to the community, including those who do provide valid criticism or bring it the way you did. At least cut him some slack.

G e e I c o u l d n ' t i m a g i n e w h a t i t w o u l d b e l i k e t o h a v e t h e e n t i r e c o m m u n i t y t u r n a g a i n s t y o u w h e n i p u t h o u r s o f e f f o r t i n t o m a k i n g m o d s f o r p e o p l e t o e n j o y ...



Before anyone gets salty it was a joke. I'm not actually serious

 

[Fabsol]

If the entire community turned against me then this mod would be gone. Too bad none of the people that hate me have any means to communicate with me anymore, isn't that a damn shame

I'll remain happy no matter what happens. A few bumps along the way cannot dissuade me from doing what I want to do.

Again, perhaps I was a bit too harsh earlier, and I apologize. Could have been worse, I could have tried to rally the entire community against you like some sort of subhuman monster :v

 

[Graydee]

If the entire community turned against me then this mod would be gone. Too bad none of the people that hate me have any means to communicate with me anymore, isn't that a damn shame

I'll remain happy no matter what happens. A few bumps along the way cannot dissuade me from doing what I want to do.

Again, perhaps I was a bit too harsh earlier, and I apologize. Could have been worse, I could have tried to rally the entire community against you like some sort of subhuman monster :v

that would be awwfuullll. Especially if you posted a blatant message on your discord describing why I'm terrible and lying about my actions...


We should probably stop here, no?

 

[Uncle Danny]

Okay, okay...I said I was going to drop this, but since you're calling me out by name, let me address this.

I'll start with the key misconception here. I'm not complaining about trying to compensate for power creep. I'm complaining that the method is sloppy and doesn't really work. I'm complaining that it's annoying-hard, not fun-hard. You can balance things without just resorting to taking things away from the player, and changes by addition are always usually better than changes by subtraction.

The thing is, though, I have no problem with the idea of making changes to give OP players a challenge, but there was no need for a hard-coded limit when the mechanics of the game already put a maximum on. Sure, other mods can add to the numbers, but balancing around every other mod out there is an exercise in futility. Someone will always make OP gear or outright cheats. Someone will always make dev items and debug tools accessible. The only consistency you can guarantee is internal, and at best with a few other mods with whom you actively work to maintain compatibility. Outside of that is just chaos and no-man's land.

As I said, not all his methods are as thought out as others, in these cases the people who think so should suggest methods that would work better or point him in the right direction, which sadly isn't done the majority of the time.

As for the limit, it wouldn't be difficult at all to add. It would be a good idea to do so, especially since they started to adjust the game to support modding more.

Either way, I understand your view on it, and I appreciated that you stayed civil through this conversation. Seems to be hard to find lately.