Game Mechanics Bring Back the Sun! (Remix Seed)

[MegaMage314 🌳]

My idea is pretty simple so I'll cut right to the chase:

I think the sun with it's normal day night cycle should be added back in the remix and possibly zenith seeds
BUT
only after the player has defeated the Moon Lord for the first time.
Everything else about the world would remain unchanged, like world generation and events happening underground and so on, but after the moon lord is slain the sun would finally rise for the first time on a now livable surface.

Now, why do I think this would be a good change? Well, it all started when I read a comment somewhere (don't remember where) saying that the entire surface of the remix seed being corrupted might be a reference to Terraria Otherworld. You know, that spin-off of terraria where the world began corrupted and your primary goal would have been to cleanse and purify the entire world had the game been finished.

Later on I found out that it probably wasn't a reference due to purification powder and the clentaminator being unobtainable on this seed (something I honestly think should be changed since it feels like a weird and not very fun thing to just remove outright) but regardless it got me thinking. The premise of the remix seed is wild, right? you start out in the underworld, slowly make a grueling climb through the layers of the world to reach the surface, and then when you finally get there you're greeted not by warm rays of sunshine, but by a dark, corrupted and unlivable surface. The world isn't just flipped, it's completely dead on the outside with no sun to be found, and now only underground is it possible for most life to survive.

So given all of that... wouldn't it be amazing if you as a player were able to do something about it? Imagine: After spending dozens and dozens of hours in a world having to live underground and fighting for your life on the pitch black surface, you finally take on the moon lord, defeat him, and then as your reward you get to see the sun rise for the very first time to signify that your challenge is complete at last.
Terraria has never been particularly heavy on story (you mostly just fight bosses to get cool loot to fight stronger bosses and repeat), but with this relatively simple change, the remix seed would suddenly have an interesting motive and story reason for fighting the Moon Lord; something beyond just getting the cool stuff he drops. He's not just the final boss who drops the best loot now, he's the guy who snuffed out the sun, plunged the entire world into darkness, and now you as the player are the only one who can bring the sun back for your townsfolk and all the other friendly creatures that call Terraria home. Simply bringing the sun back after his death would imply so much about him and his influence without a single word, and while it might be a bit of a stretch in terms of lore I think it would make for a really cool addition.

But with all that said, let me know what you think! Do you think this would be a good change? Have you played the Remix seed yet? Did you even know the Clentaminator wasn't available in it? Leave a comment with your thoughts if you have any, and thank you for reading to the end!

 

[Melania~♡]

Ready to wait another 8 years?

I think this is an awesome idea, and I'm all for it. Like you said, it's a pretty simple change on a world that is already super weird. That'd be a really nice touch to have on the credit screen

 

[MegaMage314 🌳]

Ready to wait another 8 years?

Oh dear god no

If it comes down to it I swear I'll find a way to mod this one in myself instead of waiting, lol

 

[Melania~♡]

Oh dear god no

If it comes down to it I swear I'll find a way to mod this one in myself, lol

Let hope it doesn't come to that.

Should be a very easy mod, though. If I'm correct, all you have to do is enable a daylight cycle once Moodlord is defeated

tr could be coded weirdly, though, so who knows? They could've removed it entirely.

 

[Toxophilite [East]]

I'd have to thoroughly play through it to confirm myself, but from what I hear, this is a "what if..." Seed from a Lore perspective.

I wish I'd gotten around to solving the mystery between the Solar and Lunar Cultists, as I'm certain that the Jungle Temple being on the surface, plays some significant role on why the sun is extinguished. There's some Lore going on here that I can't quite put my finger on just yet, but I do know that Solar Eclipse enemies still appear in this seed [which makes sense, though I don't know how it's executed].

Still, I have to assume this is a "what if the good guys/ other side lost" seed. If so, the World can't be "saved", it's too late. The best you can hope for is vengeance, pretty heavy stuff if you ask me [and if it's not a reach]. You can certainly take out "Thanos", but you can't undo "the snap".

 

[MegaMage314 🌳]

Makes sense. I imagine if that is the case that would explain why the clentaminator isn't available anymore (falls in line with the idea that what's done is done and it's to late for you to do anything about it). I understand if the developers feel differently and wouldn't make this change because that's their lore, but in my humble opinion I do not like that, lol.

Like I get the idea, and for certain games that premise can be really interesting, but for Terraria specifically it feels counter-intuitive to what makes the game so great in the first place. The games entire identity is that it's a sandbox that you can shape yourself, and some of it's most memorable moments are those like defeating the wall of flesh for the first time and having that completely alter the world you've grown so familiar with up to that point. To me at least, this idea would just be a natural extension of stuff like that, and not having something like this happen after defeating the moon-themed final boss feels less like an interesting lore choice and more a missed opportunity.

 

[Toxophilite [East]]

...and wouldn't make this change because that's their lore, but in my humble opinion I do not like that, lol.

I get it... on the other hand, as a person who makes Adventure Maps, I've been waiting forever to have World Seeds with different rule-sets to play around with, as the Vanilla mechanics got in the way of creativity sometimes, but not always. A Map where it's always Night, no matter what, is probably one of, if not the most requested feature for this I'd assume.

The other, is likely having the power to change the Players "spawn point", which certain Seeds also do. I don't know, certain World Seeds having an identity, and sticking to it, feels nice IMHO, but it's not unusual for Terrarians to disagree!

...and not having something like this happen after defeating the moon-themed final boss feels less like an interesting lore choice and more a missed opportunity.

Fair enough, but there's plenty of other Seeds that we have where the sun isn't so shy about "popping up". Remix Seed just seems to be the exception to the rule, even having its own set of special rules for being punished for "doing normal stuff you're used to doing". Considering the tone and atmosphere of this Seed, it feels like a mistake to make it "more of the same" to me.

The whole point of these Special Seeds were to be "unique", a nice lil' change-up from the usual [10+ years of the usual in fact]. Seems like a major setback to go backward IMHO.

In any case, I'm really enjoying the updates, how about yourself?

 

[MegaMage314 🌳]

Fair enough, but there's plenty of other Seeds that we have where the sun isn't so shy about "popping up". Remix Seed just seems to be the exception to the rule, even having its own set of special rules for being punished for "doing normal stuff you're used to doing". Considering the tone and atmosphere of this Seed, it feels like a mistake to make it "more of the same" to me.

The whole point of these Special Seeds were to be "unique", a nice lil' change-up from the usual [10+ years of the usual in fact]. Seems like a major setback to go backward IMHO.

I get that and I agree, that's why I specified that this change should only happen after moon lord, once the credits roll and players have essentially beaten the game at that point. It's not more of the same because everything else about the seed would stay unchanged post-moon lord, and it's not less unique because players will still spend the entirety of their playthrough in that permanent night. I could see an argument against this if people spent a lot of time with the world after fighting the moon lord, but like... I dunno. As is, I can't see any reason players would stick to the remix seed for long once the challenge is over and the novelty has worn off. The main incentive to keep playing beyond that would probably be building, and I can't imagine any builder would prefer the surface stay pitch black and infested with enemies. If this change gave players a reason to stick with the remix seed longer when they otherwise would've stopped playing and moved on, then that's just a good thing IMO.

I'm also not opposed to some sort of method to maybe toggle the permanent night if for whatever reason players wanted to bring that back after moon lord (maybe it could even be used in non-remix worlds to give them permanent night), but for the sake of simplicity I wanted to go for something that I felt would have the most impact while changing or adding as little as possible.

Also, fun fact:

The other, is likely having the power to change the Players "spawn point", which certain Seeds also do.

it is actually possible to set the world spawn to be wherever you want using TEdit. Back in early 2020 I actually did exactly that to make my own "Remix" playthrough of sorts before even 1.4 had released. What I did was simply use TEdit to set my spawn just above the underworld, which looked like this:

Spoiler

In my case it was obviously a lot less interesting than the real thing, but I still had a decent amount of fun with it, lol. I ended up stopping the playthrough once I made it to the surface, since at that point I felt I had overcame the challenge of having to deal with an underworld spawn.

It's kinda funny playing now and seeing this weird idea made into a legitimate thing in-game. I've put my playthrough of that on pause for now for other games and other projects, but I have been having fun with that as well as the bits of new content that I have gotten to play with so far.

 

[Toxophilite [East]]

I'm also not opposed to some sort of method to maybe toggle the permanent night if for whatever reason players wanted to bring that back after moon lord (maybe it could even be used in non-remix worlds to give them permanent night), but for the sake of simplicity I wanted to go for something that I felt would have the most impact while changing or adding as little as possible.

Typically when I'm analyzing the game, I do it from a "birds eye view" perspective, in other words, "what would this change impact if it was or wasn't made?"

Again, I have yet to play the Seed myself just yet, but I suspect quite a few things are different there.

1. Bosses normally restricted to a time of day, likely aren't limited by those rules anymore.
2. This likely means both Skeletron, and Skeletron Prime no longer enrage during the Daytime.
3. This likely also means that both of 'em, to include other Bosses, can be summoned at any time of day.
4. This likely also means that certain Potted Plants will always be availible, like Moonglow, and others will not.
5. Fishing is likely unaffected by Daytime in some instances, or certain times of day have no effect at all because they are removed.
6. Windy Days are likely impossible, and Slimes will likely never spawn on the Surface.
7. etc.

A lot of this stuff surpasses novelty, especially if you know what your signing up for if you build here, or create an Adventure Map around such themes [as it'd be the entire point of doing so].

Don't underestimate the power of Terraria's seemingly simple mechanics, they effect much more of the game than you'd originally think!

 

[MegaMage314 🌳]

Typically when I'm analyzing the game, I do it from a "birds eye view" perspective, in other words, "what would this change impact if it was or wasn't made?"

Again, I have yet to play the Seed myself just yet, but I suspect quite a few things are different there.

1. Bosses normally restricted to a time of day, likely aren't limited by those rules anymore.
2. This likely means both Skeletron, and Skeletron Prime no longer enrage during the Daytime.
3. This likely also means that both of 'em, to include other Bosses, can be summoned at any time of day.
4. This likely also means that certain Potted Plants will always be availible, like Moonglow, and others will not.
5. Fishing is likely unaffected by Daytime in some instances, or certain times of day have no effect at all because they are removed.
6. Windy Days are likely impossible, and Slimes will likely never spawn on the Surface.
7. etc.

A lot of this stuff surpasses novelty, especially if you know what your signing up for if you build here, or create an Adventure Map around such themes [as it'd be the entire point of doing so].

Don't underestimate the power of Terraria's seemingly simple mechanics, they effect much more of the game than you'd originally think!

Having played the seed myself, the only one of those that I can verify is the thing about being able to summon bosses at any time of day and skeletron not being enraged (which I guess by extension means that the enraged empress of light fight just isn't available at all in the remix seed or zenith seeds).

Most other stuff regarding the day night cycle still works as normal as far as I can tell. Daybloom still blooms when it would be day and moonglow still blooms at night, NPCs still show up at their normal times and stay indoors at night or leave in the case of the traveling merchant, blood moons still start and end and the same time and most other surface events like wind, rain and invasions simply happen underground now (though I've heard the solar eclipse is changed since it wouldn't make sense to have a solar eclipse with no sun).

Honestly now that I think about it, it'd probably be worth having this change just to make enraged empress of light and the terraprisma accessible again. I should've mentioned that in the original post lol