Weapons & Equip Throwing Class Overhaul and Hardmode Thrower Stuff

[CellarDoor96]

It would be kind of cool if there was an atomic bomb that destroys everything on screen, it could beused to create large underground areas.

Oh, and it wouldn't be so effective in fighting since it kills the player aswell.

Maybe as a last shot

That's an interesting idea, I've been trying to come up with good ideas for explosives.

Dunno what it would be called or how it would be obtained, but how's this for stats?

1000 throwing damage
65 use time
4 velocity
Explodes with a 5-second delay, damaging all enemies, players, and NPCs and destroying blocks within a 200-block radius

Technically this would still be survivable since you'd need an attack with a power of 2014 or more to kill any player in one shot (that damage reduction is a powerful thing), but at that level it'd be hard to balance it without giving it a use time of like 100. 1000 base damage should still be enough to kill most players in one hit, especially if the player that threw it has damage bonuses.

Also I rebalanced some of the gear, the armors are now better while some of the weapons have been nerfed slightly. I also added some clarification about piercing where I felt it was needed.

 

[Pikadex]

Remember that piercing damage in this game gives enemies invulnerability to other simultaneous sources of piercing damage, so only one boss could damage an enemy at a time. This means that one boss would damage the enemy six times a second, which along with the MCCs themselves (which do not deal piercing damage) would give an overall average DPS of 1065 if at least one boss was on top of the enemy at all times. That's a little bit higher than the simplified "one-hit one-attack" estimate I gave above, but not by much.

But there will most likely be multiple bosses on top, multiplying the DPS still. Your calculation before included, in theory, as many bosses as could be fit into a second with its fire rate, which would explain why moving 1 hit to 6 gives so little of an increase.

As for the size of the bosses, I actually haven't decided on that myself. On the one hand having all of them at full size would probably make the screen too busy, but on the other hand the idea is to give the player the feeling that they have "tamed" the bosses themselves, not miniature versions of them. I guess a good compromise would be to let the ones that are already pretty small (King Slime, Skeletron, Lunatic Cultist, etc.) stay as they are but scale down the bigger ones (Moon Lord, Golem, Duke Fishron, etc.).

With the King Slime one, it's actually fairly big at full size, so I'd say a lower-health king slime would be more appropriate. I'm thinking the max size should be around that of Skeletron's head.

Well, it's an exploding space station. And it's meant to be the logical conclusion of explosive-type weapons like grenades, so the high damage is more or less the idea.

That's true. Good point, there.

Don't have much else to say about your other points. Thanks for considering some of my thoughts. Throwing should become a class of its own, and I think this could go somewhere.

It would be kind of cool if there was an atomic bomb that destroys everything on screen, it could beused to create large underground areas.

Oh, and it wouldn't be so effective in fighting since it kills the player aswell.

Maybe as a last shot

That sounds like a very effective griefing tool. D:

 

[ballista rod]

But there will most likely be multiple bosses on top, multiplying the DPS still. Your calculation before included, in theory, as many bosses as could be fit into a second with its fire rate, which would explain why moving 1 hit to 6 gives so little of an increase.



With the King Slime one, it's actually fairly big at full size, so I'd say a lower-health king slime would be more appropriate. I'm thinking the max size should be around that of Skeletron's head.



That's true. Good point, there.

Don't have much else to say about your other points. Thanks for considering some of my thoughts. Throwing should become a class of its own, and I think this could go somewhere.



That sounds like a very effective griefing tool. D:

Oh...
Yeah, trolls could use it to destroy buildings if that is what you meant...

 

[CellarDoor96]

But there will most likely be multiple bosses on top, multiplying the DPS still. Your calculation before included, in theory, as many bosses as could be fit into a second with its fire rate, which would explain why moving 1 hit to 6 gives so little of an increase.

You didn't read what I said. Enemies can only be damaged by a single source of piercing damage at one time. This means that no matter whether you have one or eight or five hundred bosses on top of an enemy, only one of them will actually be dealing damage to it. So the MCC projectile itself would be dealing damage as fast as it can be thrown, but the enemy would only be taking damage from the bosses - any of them - a total of 6 times per second. Ignore the first DPS estimate I gave, I wasn't thinking it through fully, but the actual DPS isn't too different.

With the King Slime one, it's actually fairly big at full size, so I'd say a lower-health king slime would be more appropriate. I'm thinking the max size should be around that of Skeletron's head.

I was thinking more along the lines of the Eye of Cthulhu. They should still be allowed to get pretty big because you want to feel like you're throwing bosses, not just regular enemies.

I might leave Moon Lord at his full size, too, even if the other bosses get scaled down, since he shows up so rarely and does so much more damage that you'll want to notice when he's there, and because he's rare he won't spam up the screen too much. Should he get his special screen-flash spawning animation, too?

Also, how should the Eater of Worlds and Destroyer be handled? Most likely they'd be a lot shorter than they actually are, but I don't know if they should be scaled down to match. I think shortening them to around 10 or so segments but keeping their width should be fine, right?

That sounds like a very effective griefing tool. D:

That's true, but it's not like griefing isn't already ridiculously easy anyway with stuff like the DCU. In fact, explosives are arguably less effective at griefing than the DCU, since at least you can make stuff out of Lihzahrd or Dungeon brick and have it be immune to explosives.

 

[CellarDoor96]

Added the Flower Discus and changed Present Bomb to Bauble Bomb. This might cause some confusion with the Bubble Bomb, so if anyone has any suggestions for better names for either of them then please let me know, but I like both of them and they fit pretty well. Of the two I like the wordplay in Bauble Bomb better, so I'd be more willing to change the Bubble Bomb.

 

[ballista rod]

How about a thrown dart trap?

It can be thrown to any block and it will start shooting at enemies for some time, not too long so it's not a summon weapon.

After that it drops

 

[CellarDoor96]

It's an interesting idea, but I think that at that point most people are going to want either a regular dart trap they don't have to maintain or something they can throw at enemies directly. Traps and thrown weapons both have their niches, but combining them would lose what makes them useful in the first place.

 

[ballista rod]

It's an interesting idea, but I think that at that point most people are going to want either a regular dart trap they don't have to maintain or something they can throw at enemies directly. Traps and thrown weapons both have their niches, but combining them would lose what makes them useful in the first place.

Okay
I was thinking, are the galaxy throwing weapons affected by gravity?
The name suggestes so
That's it, how aboit an accessory that negates throwing weapons' gravity so they would go in a straight line?

 

[CellarDoor96]

The Galaxy Arm isn't affected by gravity, and only the Big Banger's initial singularity attack is affected by gravity. In any case I don't know about an accessory that only affects two weapons, plus changing such a fundamental part of how a weapon works doesn't feel right to me.

Now that you mention it, though, I should probably include whether each weapon is affected by gravity. I'll do that sometime.

 

[ballista rod]

Okay

I meant every throwing weapon

 

[CellarDoor96]

I'll think about it, but I don't know. Like I said, arc is a pretty fundamental part of how throwing weapons work gameplay-wise, especially when it comes to ones that are meant to be short-range like bombs.

 

[ballista rod]

I'll think about it, but I don't know. Like I said, arc is a pretty fundamental part of how throwing weapons work gameplay-wise, especially when it comes to ones that are meant to be short-range like bombs.

Probably.

Water balloons?
An another for fun item, can be thrown, deals some knockback and leaves a block of water wherever it lands

Of course, lava and honey versions

Made by using empty balloons(sold by Party Girl?) the same way you would use buckets, by clicking the water.

The balloons could also be crafted to Shiny Red Balloon-like accessory(by using a helium tank crafting station) that could be combined with the Confetti in a Bottle(crafted from confetti and a bottle/cloud in a bottle) to create the Confetti Balloon
That could be combined with the three other forgotten balloons to make a bigger bundle of balloons and further combined with the original Bundle of Balloons to create a colossal stack of 7 balloons
It also releases quick leaking mini balloons when hurt, like the Honey Balloon

Whoops, these are not throwing stuff anymore
I think jumping is extremely important when using throwing weapons.
The ballons can be crafted to create some more throwing weapons
-by combining it with chain and anvil(was thinking about grappling hook but it would make it too expensive) you can make a weapon that attachs to the enemies, leaving the heavy anvil and lifting the enemy away via a debuff that adds the balloon to the sprite of the enemy

Poison gas Balloon
-when thrown it will go upwards, exploding after hitting anything, including player projectiles
-spreads a poison cloud, dealing damage to enemies
-crafted from an empty balloon and... I'm not sure yet.

 

[Chry]

Ok. I'm just going to say that if the Dev's don't see this and put it in the game, I'm going to be so annoyed. I would LOVE to play a throwing class, especially since it's pretty fun pre-hardmode, but with absolutely no hardmode content, it becomes a waste of time. I really love the work you've put into this and I hope that all the staff see this and put it in as I want the throwing class to be so much better!

You've put a lot of thought into this. I think it looks quite balanced, with a nice variety of weapons/armor/accessories for different personalities/play styles.

I would suggest at least two more armour's if possible. Maybe one extra one for pre-hardmode? Maybe? Just a suggestion of course

I also have a suggestion for Coral/Seashells. So far, Coral isn't used for much of anything, and I think it could be crafted into some really early game weapons. Seashells can be really sharp, as can coral, and they are generally light weight, so could be useful as a nice throwing weapon. I am not sure if these are good idea's. Just something that I thought of while readying through the thread.

 

[ballista rod]

Ok. I'm just going to say that if the Dev's don't see this and put it in the game, I'm going to be so annoyed. I would LOVE to play a throwing class, especially since it's pretty fun pre-hardmode, but with absolutely no hardmode content, it becomes a waste of time. I really love the work you've put into this and I hope that all the staff see this and put it in as I want the throwing class to be so much better!

You've put a lot of thought into this. I think it looks quite balanced, with a nice variety of weapons/armor/accessories for different personalities/play styles.

I would suggest at least two more armour's if possible. Maybe one extra one for pre-hardmode? Maybe? Just a suggestion of course

I also have a suggestion for Coral/Seashells. So far, Coral isn't used for much of anything, and I think it could be crafted into some really early game weapons. Seashells can be really sharp, as can coral, and they are generally light weight, so could be useful as a nice throwing weapon. I am not sure if these are good idea's. Just something that I thought of while readying through the thread.

Thrown sea stars?
-They might work like Spiky Balls
-Can be fished from the ocean
-More powerful than Spiky Balls
-needs a high bait power(for balancing and the fact that sea stars might be extremely hard to catch using a fishing pole anyway)
-actually, sea urchins work better for this, sea stars work like shurikens now

 

[CellarDoor96]

Balloon stuff

I like the idea of thrown water/honey/etc. balloons, but I can't really think of a good way to obtain them. I'm not sure about making a separate balloon item that you fill with water since there are already Shiny Red Balloons, and I'd use that, but they're way too rare and valuable to use on an early-game consumable weapon. Maybe some kind of balloon pump item that somehow lets you craft them?

Ok. I'm just going to say that if the Dev's don't see this and put it in the game, I'm going to be so annoyed. I would LOVE to play a throwing class, especially since it's pretty fun pre-hardmode, but with absolutely no hardmode content, it becomes a waste of time. I really love the work you've put into this and I hope that all the staff see this and put it in as I want the throwing class to be so much better!

You've put a lot of thought into this. I think it looks quite balanced, with a nice variety of weapons/armor/accessories for different personalities/play styles.

Thank you very much! I did put a lot of thought into this, so I'm glad you like it. Unfortunately there's no real way to tell how balanced it actually is until it's put into the game, but I did my best.

I would suggest at least two more armour's if possible. Maybe one extra one for pre-hardmode? Maybe? Just a suggestion of course

I had considered a Baseball armor for prehardmode like @samufinland suggested, but I don't think it needs any more prehardmode armors than it already has. Most other classes only have one or two prehardmode armors, and I think Ninja and Fossil armor serve the throwing class pretty well already. Plus, five armors brings the throwing class up to par with summoners, who also only have five armors (actually throwing arguably would have more, since I usually consider Spooky and Tiki to be the same tier).

I also have a suggestion for Coral/Seashells. So far, Coral isn't used for much of anything, and I think it could be crafted into some really early game weapons. Seashells can be really sharp, as can coral, and they are generally light weight, so could be useful as a nice throwing weapon. I am not sure if these are good idea's. Just something that I thought of while readying through the thread.

Thrown sea stars?
-They might work like Spiky Balls
-Can be fished from the ocean
-More powerful than Spiky Balls
-needs a high bait power(for balancing and the fact that sea stars might be extremely hard to catch using a fishing pole anyway)
-actually, sea urchins work better for this, sea stars work like shurikens now

I like the idea of throwing urchins and sea stars, I might work that in somehow. I know that starfish are already an item in the game, but they're just placeable background objects you find on the ocean floor.

 

[ballista rod]

I like the idea of thrown water/honey/etc. balloons, but I can't really think of a good way to obtain them. I'm not sure about making a separate balloon item that you fill with water since there are already Shiny Red Balloons, and I'd use that, but they're way too rare and valuable to use on an early-game consumable weapon. Maybe some kind of balloon pump item that somehow lets you craft them?

Didn't I mention them being sold by Party Girl? What if they are called water balloons even when empty?

 

[CellarDoor96]

Didn't I mention them being sold by Party Girl? What if they are called water balloons even when empty?

It wouldn't make sense to call them water balloons when they're empty. And like I said, I don't want to add a separate balloon item since there's already the Shiny Red Balloon. I guess the Party Girl could sell the filled water balloons directly, but then there wouldn't be any way to make honey or lava ones, unless we want to clutter up her shop selling all three separately. Which is a possibility I suppose, but I'll have to think about it.

In any case the focus of this expansion is supposed to be on hardmode, so I don't want to suggest too many frivolous early game things.

 

[ballista rod]

It wouldn't make sense to call them water balloons when they're empty. And like I said, I don't want to add a separate balloon item since there's already the Shiny Red Balloon. I guess the Party Girl could sell the filled water balloons directly, but then there wouldn't be any way to make honey or lava ones, unless we want to clutter up her shop selling all three separately. Which is a possibility I suppose, but I'll have to think about it.

In any case the focus of this expansion is supposed to be on hardmode, so I don't want to suggest too many frivolous early game things.

What if thrown weapons bounce off pink slime blocks, making an unique fighting style where you can place pink slime blocks in certain to extend your range?

 

[CellarDoor96]

What if thrown weapons bounce off pink slime blocks, making an unique fighting style where you can place pink slime blocks in certain to extend your range?

An interesting idea, but most projectiles in Terraria have their range measured in either blocks traveled or flight time, so bouncing them wouldn't actually extend your range at all. At best it would be useful for trick shots through narrow spaces, but chances are if you can place pink slime blocks you've already terraformed that environment to your advantage.

 

[ballista rod]

An interesting idea, but most projectiles in Terraria have their range measured in either blocks traveled or flight time, so bouncing them wouldn't actually extend your range at all. At best it would be useful for trick shots through narrow spaces, but chances are if you can place pink slime blocks you've already terraformed that environment to your advantage.

Yeah. More pink slime throwinf wepons it is.

I would want to see shurikens used as they are used in real life like using them at short range melee weapons and sticking them to ground where someone might step on them