To Those Who Complain About 'Cheap Tactics'

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That Man In The Corner

That Man In The Corner

Terrarian
So many people have been talking about how most people use so called 'cheap tactics' to beat the moon lord. Usually they are referring to using the magic mirror to warp back to your house, healing, and going back into the fight. My question is, why is this cheap? Sounds like an easy question to answer: cuz it's like, too easy bro.

But the whole point of that kind of tactics is exploiting flaws in the boss's AI to beat it easily. Alot of people claim that using the razorblade typhoon to beat the moon lord is also cheap. (ok that one is just stupid and dumb and it's technically not the kind of tactics i'm talking about.) I find the destroyer to be the easiest boss in hardmode, no i'm not joking. I put myself in a box high in the sky to block all of it's lasers and use the clockwork assault rifle and/or nimbus rod to shoot at it through a single platform. When probes come i use my sword to beat him off and this makes the destroyer ultra easy. Another strategy is using the slime mount to bounce on top of it and shoot it. People find these tricks cheap cuz they also make it 'too easy' or whatnot. While some may just be jealous of your brilliant tactics, other legitimately find this like cheating. This is because they don't feel like that is the proper way to fight the boss which i understand but on the other hand. . . Who made this 'right way' to beat the boss? It's not like people who use these tactics are using outside sources to beat it. They just found a convenient way to beat the boss a different way compared to most people. So while some people call this 'cheap tactics' I really prefer to call this creative tactics. Tactics that find the most effective way to beat the boss for people who aren't as good at performing complex dodges. Either way if this didn't convince you, i'd honestly like to hear why. Oh and on a side note, if you don't like the methods, just don't use them.
 
I don't see people complaining about others using cheap tactics because most likely they do it themselves. I haven't given the Moon Lord a go in Expert Mode, so I have no clue how hard he is to fight, but I can assure you I haven't once, well every time I've defeated him that is, used the Magic Mirror and get Health from the Nurse. I've actually never gotten health from the nurse. But that's just me, as I'm not used to it.

And since I don't use that tactic I'm not going to say it's cheap as it's, as you said, a flaw in the Moon Lords AI, which more or less should be similar to the Wall of Flesh. If you flee you die.
 
In general I dont give a single f*ck about what those ppl say. You could also argue that my way of fighting brain of cthulu is cheap (I build a bed in the crimson, and summon him, then just start throwing grenades where I stand. I will kill myself, and do a ton of dmg to him. Since he doesn't despawn while I am dead, I can instantly throw more nades when i get back alive, and repeat the process untill he is dead). I dont feel that this is cheap. You beat the boss however you can. The moonlord is terrible at attacking targets hiding under solid bricks, so its very easy to beat him with a simple arena, even without the nurse.
Every boss in the game has flaws, that is what is so great about it. They all have a weakness, which makes them actually able to be killed.

Sure, we could ask the devs to give the moon lord 1 Million Hp, and 10.000 dmg with every attack, which penetrates 90% of your armor, but would that make anybody happy? No, I hardly think so.

It's just a game, let people play it how they want, and play your own game as you want = Everybody (should be) happy.
 
This is a game. It's meant for your enjoyment for your leisure time to get away from the crap in your life. Play it however you like to. You did not pay for it for others to tell you how it should be experienced.

It is also primarily a single player and co-op game. You don't harm anyone by cheesing or cheating; you aren't being unfair or a douchebag.

EDIT: the fact that so many players do use such tactics speaks about the boss/items design more than about the players
 
Maybe Moon Lord needs to be able to vastly accelerate if he gets a too far from a player. Or even teleport.
 
No it doesn't, unless ML also receives an overhaul. The only way some players could beat him at all the first time was using cheap tactics. They exist from necessity not because players want to cheat the game. They do not want to do it, but have little other choice.

We don't really have a representative forum population for the casual players. They play the game after school or work then get on to chores. They don't have time to be on forums to speak of their woes.
 
The way you see: 'Everyone is having problems with us using cheap tactics'.

The way people like me see it: 'We don't like the way you do it, but we aren't going to stop you.'

I don't see a point in fighting a boss if all you're going to do is avoid nearly all of its mechanics and dangers. You might as well just be given the items as soon as you use the summoning item. There is a difference between smartly surviving certain dangers and eliminating the risk of it altogether.

Now, the issue I have is when someone uses cheap tactics and then uses it for bragging rights. Congrats, you stood still for the majority of the fight shooting down. That's real difficult.
 
Know what the problem really is? Gamers are too used to games where what others do affect your gameplay (cheaters in MMORPGs killing all the mobs in an area, players in FPSs who shoot you through walls) and try to apply the same mentality to Terraria.

Those "cheap" tactics? They're there so everyone can beat the boss. But that doesn't mean everyone has to use them. Gamers need to top acting like the devs are putting guns to their foreheads and forcing them to use the easy way out. Also, some gamers need to rid themselves of their pointless pride and admit they lack the skills required to kill the boss the "right" way. This is not a contest, this is a single player-focused game. Abandon that MMO mentality, guys, it's only hurting your image.
 
Besides, I think the only class that can even stand a chance in a "fair" fight against the Moon Lord is a very tanky Melee user. And even then, trying to solo him without extra health recovery? That's not going to end well. And that's just on normal.
 
FlakMaster said:
The way you see: 'Everyone is having problems with us using cheap tactics'.

The way people like me see it: 'We don't like the way you do it, but we aren't going to stop you.
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I'm not really talking about people like you, some people get really ticked off when someone even uses those tactics and call them cheap or playing the game wrong, i was mainly trying to refer to people who don't like the way i do it AND start trash talking me and others like me because they hate how we do it. I don't mind as much of people don't bully other BECAUSE of their ways of doing it, not everyone is a pro.
 
I haven't beaten ML, but jesus it's hard, even with melee, you can't get health recovery from anything other than potions, (May be a bug, hope not) so going to the nurse is fine. If you kill a boss with instakill on a MMORPG game, that is going to F**k up someones day. But if you're beating the HARDEST boss SOLO, it's almost impossible. Anyone complaining about "cheap tactics" needs to stop.
 
Gr3ysc413 said:
I haven't beaten ML, but jesus it's hard, even with melee, you can't get health recovery from anything other than potions, (May be a bug, hope not)
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One patch specifically stated that lifesteal effects are nullified when fighting Moon Lord.

However, Heart Statues still work fine. Wire some up with some pressure plates, preferably in separate batches of 3 each, and you've greatly increased your ability to survive.
 
Let's be honest: Nullifying the health drain mechanics (no, it's not a bug) is not "limiting." Basing your gameplay on one single mechanic is what's limiting. Now you can explore other options, or "cheat" using the Nurse if you don't want to hone your skills at all. Both are viable options.

And before the same "old" fallacy shows its ugly face: No, it's not just tanky "classes" that can kill the ML. You can kill it as a mage or ranger, as long as you don't act like you have a Medusa near you during the whole fight. As a summoner, you'll need to move a whole damn lot. Still, sticking to those made-belief fallacies known as Terraria classes is a choice, and has consequences.
 
Cheapness is highly subjective. What is cheap to one person is legit to another. You can decide what ever playing rules you want to use but you can't force them upon others. Sometimes these kind of rules are referred to as challenges.

In my books, building arenas to fight mobs/bosses is not cheap. Terraria is also a building game and you can't say without any narrative whether player character is supposed to know about the incoming event/boss. You can use your imagination and decide what ever you want.

Realism as an argument for glorious non-cheap tactics is not a good one. For example, if taking advantage of your environment and altering the battle field is cheap, then all real life combatants are cheap. What ever is the case, they still abuse everything they can because our reality favors those who fight dirty, dishonorable and with brains. I don't see why this kind of fighting in Terraria couldn't be smart and allowed.
 
Kyouko Tsukino said:
Let's be honest: Nullifying the health drain mechanics (no, it's not a bug) is not "limiting." Basing your gameplay on one single mechanic is what's limiting. Now you can explore other options, or "cheat" using the Nurse if you don't want to hone your skills at all.
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You're saying that as if the drain mechanics prevented players to explore other options, and denying them that has freed them. If you make something unusable you're limiting the options available, not diversifying them.

They had their downside already - severely reduced damage.

I don't get how people see other ways to cheat as a much better alternative than life drain. We wouldn't need life drain at all if not for potion sickness (a mechanic that seems to exist solely for players to use heart statues and camp fires/heart lanterns)
 
Grimmsy said:
I don't get how people see other ways to cheat as a much better alternative than life drain. We wouldn't need life drain at all if not for potion sickness (a mechanic that seems to exist solely for players to use heart statues and camp fires/heart lanterns)
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They're not better, just different. And we don't need life drain at all. Next step would be to remove it completely, but I'm sure it's not a step the devs want to take. Unfortunately, I must say.
 
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