What should be considered True Melee?

[Lancer of hatred]

I'd like to know what y'all would consider true melee. Let's argue.

I would start off by saying that I'd consider anything that for a weapon to be true melee, it needs to be a melee weapon that you swing rather than throw. It needs to be short-ranged for its tier, and it needs to not have projectiles that detach from your main weapon. Basically, if it's not a flail, boomerang or yoyo and if it doesn't shoot projectiles, it's a true melee weapon.

I'd consider the Night's Edge, Rotten Fork, Dark Lance, Gungnir and True Excalibur to be true melee, despite those weapons having auras. That's because the auras are an extension of the weapon, they're made by swinging really hard, flashy effects basically. They also never detach from the main weapon themselves like a projectile would.

Projectile swords/spears deal less DPS from a distance, can attack from a distance and do more DPS when you combine the projectile with the weapon itself.

I'd also consider weapons that don't shoot projectiles but spawn projectiles on hit, like the Ghastly Glaive, Horseman's Blade and the Bladetongue to be true melee. I mean, you have better long distance options at those stages of the game, and you also have to hit your enemy in order to spawn a projectile.

I have seen a single YouTuber that I don't remember the name off but has been living in my mind rent-free argue that the Mace is true melee despite being a flail because it has less range than the Gungnir, but I would disagree. You don't really swing maces like swords and spears, it is a throwable weapon that is attached with chains that allow you to pull it back. Flails are more like boomerangs and yoyos than spears and swords.

I'd also classify shortswords as true melee, even the Gladius and the Ruler. You swing and stab with them, they're just like swords.

The starlight should also be true melee. It has extremely short range for its tier, it is not thrown, and the light beams are part of the weapon. The light beams don't shoot. I mean, can you really call it a projectile? By definition, projectiles are things that are thrown, they need to be detached from the shooter. The light beams from the Starlight aren't attached.

The Arkhalis and Terragrim are also true melee, even if they're projectiles inside the code of the game, they act like short ranged melee weapons. It is clear the special attack animation is just a sword trying to simulate rapid slashes. You also swing them.

Jousting lances are true melee too. They don't shoot projectiles, so they're true melee.

I would also disqualify the Solar eruption, since it has an incredibly long range for its tier.

Do y'all agree or disagree?

 

[Green_Metaknight]

I agree.

 

[Lancer of hatred]

Fair

 

[krunkanader]

If the part that attacking an enemy is directly connected to the part that the player is holding, it is true melee. Or that's what I think

 

[Lancer of hatred]

If the part that attacking an enemy is directly connected to the part that the player is holding, it is true melee. Or that's what I think

I'd say it is, unless it's a flail or boomerang.

 

[krunkanader]

I'd say it is, unless it's a flail or boomerang.

boomerangs aren't connected to the player?

 

[Lancer of hatred]

boomerangs aren't connected to the player?

Yeah

 

[Salty_]

If part of the attack continues to travel after the player has stopped holding the weapon it is not true melee.

Notable memebers of the not-true-melee group:
All Boomerangs
All Spears that shoot a projectile from their tip.
All Enchanted Sword type weapons
Flying Knife and Shadowflame Knife
Scourge of the Corruptor & Vampire Knives
All True Excalibur type weapons
True Night's Edge
Waffle's Iron
All non-tool Chlorophyte weapons
The Mushroom weapons
All Frost Moon weapons
Drippler Crippler and Flower Pow
Flairon
Terrarian
*New Phasersaber throw attack
Ice Sickle & Death Sickle
Daybreak
Star Wrath & Meowmere
Zenith

Notably, most flails fall under true melee in this definition with two exceptions.
Solar Eruption is true melee, even if it is comically long. True melee is not a range limit.

 

[Lancer of hatred]

If part of the attack continues to travel after the player has stopped holding the weapon it is not true melee.

Notable memebers of the not-true-melee group:
All Boomerangs
All Spears that shoot a projectile from their tip.
All Enchanted Sword type weapons
Flying Knife and Shadowflame Knife
Scourge of the Corruptor & Vampire Knives
All True Excalibur type weapons
True Night's Edge
Waffle's Iron
All non-tool Chlorophyte weapons
The Mushroom weapons
All Frost Moon weapons
Drippler Crippler and Flower Pow
Flairon
Terrarian
*New Phasersaber throw attack
Ice Sickle & Death Sickle
Daybreak
Star Wrath & Meowmere
Zenith

Notably, most flails fall under true melee in this definition with two exceptions.
Solar Eruption is true melee, even if it is comically long. True melee is not a range limit.

True Excalibur not being true melee while flails are indeed true melee is certainly a hot take. I disagree.

 

[Lancer of hatred]

I'd say True melee should be related to range. The reason people started saying some melee weapons are true and others aren't was inherently because of how Melee is sometimes a long range class, but that casts magic beams that don't consume mana out of a spear or sword. Therefore, Solar Eruption is not a true melee weapon.

 

[Flint🪓]

I judge “true melee weapons” if you are hitting with the actual blade and not only the external proyectile.

"Range" does not matter when it comes to a weapon's damage type. There could be a melee weapon that has infinite range (example: Influx Waver), or there could be a ranged weapon that has short range (example: Flamethrower and Elf Melter). Weapons are judged by their function and playstyles, not range.

Fair enough.

If we judge weapons from their appearance or range, then Terraprisma should be a melee weapon, all "magic guns" (example: Zapinator) should be ranged, in fact Mage and Summoner should not exist at all and we should give their weapons to melee and ranger, flamethrower and elf melter should be melee, boomerangs should be ranged etc.

I think it’s more of what do you use for them to work, for ranger you need ammo, for mage you need mana, for summoner you need minion slots.

Who came up with that definition? Projectiles are not something like that.
Additionaly, projectiles are a important, IMPORTANT part of Terraria and they are also present in melee class. Without projectiles, melee class is just sword swinging. Thats it. Projectiles allow so much more than that. Without projectiles, many weapons like Starlight, Daybreak, Solar Eruption, Zenith etc. Would not exist at all. Projectiles isnt just things that necessarily belong to Ranger or Mage. Again, projectiles are important and they allow unique weapons like The Zenith to exist. Just regular, short ranged sword swinging would not be what melee class deserves when other classes get unique weapons.

Melee weapons are weak at long range but strong at close range, an example of this is the Terrablade, for example try to use both the blade and proyectile agaisnt EoL and see how fast you melt her. On the other side melee weapons that can’t be used at long range are really powerful, like starlight.

Id’ say true melee weapons are those that can only be used with the blade.

What makes "throwing" out of question? Even in real life, there are throwable melee weapons like spears (shotout to Daybreak). Just because something is "thrown" doesnt mean that is not a melee weapon. No one can make me ever believe Boomerangs are not melee for example.

Boomerangs and yoyos deserved to be throwing, copium makes me think that the throwing class will make a comeback

I said True melee is a stupid term, but if I had to consider something "True melee", it would be anything on melee class. They are perfectly melee.

Nah, see above.

 

[Meowlegend]

I judge “true melee weapons” if you are hitting with the actual blade and not only the external proyectile.

Okay

I think it’s more of what do you use for them to work, for ranger you need ammo, for mage you need mana, for summoner you need minion slots.

Yep, exactly. Melee weapons dont need any resource, though.

Melee weapons are weak at long range but strong at close range, an example of this is the Terrablade, for example try to use both the blade and proyectile agaisnt EoL and see how fast you melt her. On the other side melee weapons that can’t be used at long range are really powerful, like starlight.

I am aware of that. That is how it should been all the time, actually.
(also I wont be testing on EoL, seriously people already hurt this woman so many times already, leave my girl alone and test on Duke fishron instead)

Boomerangs and yoyos deserved to be throwing, copium makes me think that the throwing class will make a comeback

Throwing wont be coming back because it was just Ranger and Melee with consumeables

Nah, see above.

What

 

[J Bame]

I said True melee is a stupid term, but if I had to consider something "True melee", it would be anything on melee class. They are perfectly melee.

"all melee is true melee, duh" is the kind of pedanticism that pisses me off. "True Melee" is not a literal term that defines the "real melee" class and that most Melee weapons belong to a "fake melee" class. True Melee is simply a category of weapons.

These weapons are attached to the player, meaning that while Ice Sickle's projectiles and Night's Edge have similar range, you can artificially extend the former by running away and letting enemies walk into it, while Night's Edge always needs you to stay up close to deal damage. Saying that True Melee weapons don't use projectiles is wrong, as well. Not only are you inviting a smartass to tell you that Spears are coded as projectiles, for example while Beam Sword shoots a Projectile (it literally has "beam" in the name), said projectiles are so weak that you need the blade to deal most of your damage. The projectiles in this case are a mere range extender, a way to not be completely defenseless while approaching. Others like Terra Blade also get doubled DPS while using their Melee aspect on top of their projectiles, so they can be used as true melee to an extent.

In other words, True Melee is close combat, getting up close to attack. Using Influx Waver for its beams is not True Melee, using the Influx Waver with both the beams and the sword is True Melee. Blade of Grass has a projectile, but it's extremely weak and barely reaches further than the sword does, so you will never use Blade of Grass without getting up close to hit with the blade, so Blade of Grass is always true melee. Boomerangs are not true melee, yet they work best at true melee range (this being, up close)

 

[Meowlegend]

"all melee is true melee, duh" is the kind of pedanticism that pisses me off. "True Melee" is not a literal term that defines the "real melee" class and that all Melee weapons belong to a "fake melee" class. True Melee is simply a category of weapons.

These weapons are attached to the player, meaning that while Ice Sickle's projectiles and Night's Edge have similar range, you can artificially extend the former by running away and letting enemies walk into it, while Night's Edge always needs you to stay up close to deal damage. Saying that True Melee weapons don't use projectiles is wrong, as well. Not only are you inviting a smartass to tell you that Spears are coded as projectiles, for example while Beam Sword shoots a Projectile (it literally has "beam" in the name), said projectiles are so weak that they need the blade to deal most of their damage. The projectiles in this case are a mere range extender, a way to not be completely defenseless while approaching. Others like Terra Blade also get doubled DPS while using their Melee aspect on top of their projectiles, so they can be used as true melee to an extent.

In other words, True Melee is close combat, getting up close to attack. Using Influx Waver for its beams is not True Melee, using the Influx Waver with both the beams and the sword is True Melee. Blade of Grass has a projectile, but it's extremely weak and barely reaches further than the sword does, so you will never use Blade of Grass without getting up close to hit with the blade, so Blade of Grass is always true melee. Boomerangs are not true melee, yet they work best at true melee range (this being, up close)

Okay look, you are right

 

[Glasia🌳]

All swords are true melee if there are 1000 flares lingering in the world.

 

[Meowlegend]

All swords are true melee if there are 1000 flares lingering in the world.

I actually tried that once, it becomes pretty funny. Especially with Zenith and Vampire Knives. You swing/throw nothing. Meowmere isnt Meowmere anymore. Terra Blade's all visual beauty is gone.

So in conclusion, projectiles are important

 

[Lancer of hatred]

Boomerangs and yoyos deserved to be throwing, copium makes me think that the throwing class will make a comeback

It won't lol, either way throwing weapons being absorbed into the ranger class is actually good. It's kinda annoying to run out of a weapon and lose inventory space when you lose all of your throwables.
Though Yoyos and Boomerangs even though they're projectiles, I'd still say they should keep staying in the melee class. I mean, most of them have short-medium range. They don't really go past the screen, and their DPS increase greatly when you're close to the enemy.

"all melee is true melee, duh" is the kind of pedanticism that pisses me off. "True Melee" is not a literal term that defines the "real melee" class and that most Melee weapons belong to a "fake melee" class. True Melee is simply a category of weapons.

These weapons are attached to the player, meaning that while Ice Sickle's projectiles and Night's Edge have similar range, you can artificially extend the former by running away and letting enemies walk into it, while Night's Edge always needs you to stay up close to deal damage. Saying that True Melee weapons don't use projectiles is wrong, as well. Not only are you inviting a smartass to tell you that Spears are coded as projectiles, for example while Beam Sword shoots a Projectile (it literally has "beam" in the name), said projectiles are so weak that you need the blade to deal most of your damage. The projectiles in this case are a mere range extender, a way to not be completely defenseless while approaching. Others like Terra Blade also get doubled DPS while using their Melee aspect on top of their projectiles, so they can be used as true melee to an extent.

In other words, True Melee is close combat, getting up close to attack. Using Influx Waver for its beams is not True Melee, using the Influx Waver with both the beams and the sword is True Melee. Blade of Grass has a projectile, but it's extremely weak and barely reaches further than the sword does, so you will never use Blade of Grass without getting up close to hit with the blade, so Blade of Grass is always true melee. Boomerangs are not true melee, yet they work best at true melee range (this being, up close)

I agree with most of what you say, but I think there's a difference between true melee weapons and a true melee range, as in, hitting your enemy with the blade and the projectile of the sword doesn't make your weapon a true melee weapon. I'd say that's more of a play style, I'd call it true meleeing with a projectile weapon, or well, true meleeing.

I should also say that I disagree with the Blade of grass being a true melee weapon, since it has projectiles that detach from the main weapon and deal different types of damage. They also can sometimes hit enemies from a longer distance. I mean, the Ice blade from what I've seen has poor long range damage, and it's hard to aim too so you're better off true meleeing with that weapon, but I wouldn't say that makes it a true melee weapon.

All swords are true melee if there are 1000 flares lingering in the world.

I wonder if there's a mod that would let me remove all projectiles from a sword and spear? I'd like to try all projectile swords without their additional effects and long ranged projectiles.

 

[Meowlegend]

It won't lol, either way throwing weapons being absorbed into the ranger class is actually good. It's kinda annoying to run out of a weapon and lose inventory space when you lose all of your throwables.
Though Yoyos and Boomerangs even though they're projectiles, I'd still say they should keep staying in the melee class. I mean, most of them have short-medium range. They don't really go past the screen, and their DPS increase greatly when you're close to the enemy.

Boomerangs are perfectly fine as melee weapons especially when Ranger has so many better options than Boomerangs in the game. Actually, both Melee and Ranger has so many weapons and options throughout the whole game that we dont need more weapons for those 2 classes anymore.

And also, screen size can easily be counted as a melee range, due to screen size not being as big as most people think it is.

As for being a projectile, just like I said before, projectiles are a important part of Terraria and they allow more than just sword swingings. so practically, every melee weapon, except swords' swinging hitbox, being a projectile is not a weird thing.

 

[J Bame]

I should also say that I disagree with the Blade of grass being a true melee weapon, since it has projectiles that detach from the main weapon and deal different types of damage.

The projectile is the "range extender type", you will never use Blade of Grass like an Influx Waver because that projectile by itself is extremely weak.

It works best at true melee range, and imo the projectile range is short enough to still basically be true melee.

 

[Flint🪓]

For yall: I know throwing won´t make a comeback but seeing mods like Thorium makes me think that if handled well it could´ve had potential. I didn´t meant it seriously

Also I wanna add something, could flails (without extra proyectiles) be considered true melee? Since you are hitting enemies with the actual flail.

What

I meant what I said above of what I consider "true melee" weapons.

I should also say that I disagree with the Blade of grass being a true melee weapon, since it has projectiles that detach from the main weapon and deal different types of damage.

Well, night´s edge has this "extra swing" that extends the weapons range and you can aim in any direction, going by this logic then night´s edge is not true melee.

I actually tried that once, it becomes pretty funny. Especially with Zenith and Vampire Knives. You swing/throw nothing. Meowmere isnt Meowmere anymore. Terra Blade's all visual beauty is gone.

So in conclusion, projectiles are important

The thing is that removing proyectiles makes the reworked sword unable to do damage since the "slash" effect is the thing that deals damage.