Game Mechanics Changes to Flasks

[Ravvynfall]

Hi all!

So, I did some thinking on how we could make a few rather interesting and overall, beneficial adjustments to game play that would make a large impact without having to rework a ton of items.

I propose one basic change as a whole;
I feel that the flasks should be switched from only benefiting melee to benefit *all* damage types. This would help boost the overall effectiveness of many seemingly weak weapons across the board.

For example, I've noticed that weapons such as the wasp gun are grossly underpowered after a certain point in the game and could benefit from being imbued with flasks, such as ichor, venom, fire, etc.

So rather than going and tinkering with the formulae on a plethora of items, I think this simple adjustment would help a great deal more.

What are your thoughts?
good? bad? no opinion at all? let me know

 

[Enjl]

Sounds fair, actually. Ichor-inflicting Optic Staff sounds fun. Or Stynger. Or Razorblade Typhoo... wait that item kills everything anyways.

At the same time I'm afraid this will make melee less interesting and special, as other classes have more and more fun stuff to offer - even summoner.

 

[LoM2]

Eh.

I feel like it'd make ranged either overpowered or redundant (as it has bullets that cover most of the flasks effects already, imagine shooting ichor crystal bullets.) Arguably same could be applied to magic.

 

[Lecic]

I believe the point of flasks is to make up for its lack of status-inflicting weapons. Any ranged weapon can use a status-inflicting ammo, and there's a huge number of status-inflicting spells for mages, but all the melee class gets without flasks is a handful of swords and boomerangs.

I'm going to have to say "no support" on this one.

 

[Firearrow15]

Like Lecic said, ranged and magic already have access to the same debuffs that flasks use. Want to inflict Ichor? Ichor bullets, golden shower. Want to inflict venom? Venom arrows, venom staff. The same can be said about most debuffs. None of these are melee-exclusive. If any ranged or magic weapons are underpowered, that is the problem of the weapon itself, and letting flasks affect them won't fix it.

 

[neoselket]

looks cool, but i would make it so only some flasks could be used for some weapons. for instance, ichor might only work for ranged, venom might only work for melee, fire might only work for magic, poison might only work for summoner, and confetti might work for everything. that would prevent it from being overpowered.

all the melee class gets without flasks is a handful of swords and boomerangs.

but they get tons more defense, ranged weapons that consume neither ammo nor mana, and the flasks themselves.

 

[LoveSpreader]

ichor might only work for ranged, venom might only work for melee, fire might only work for magic, poison might only work for summone

What you're proposing is even more unfair than the OP's suggestion. Ichor is pretty much the best debuff you've listed there. Ichor as it is now, benefits weapons that can hit more per second than a high damage weapon that hits slow. And guess which weapon group usually has the highest hit per second ratio? Ranged weapons. Especially true with guns + crystal bullets. And with Tsunami, 5 hits per use. Give a permanent ichor to ranged weapons, you're pretty much reducing the other weapon types to rabble.

And the currently weakest class you've given the most useless debuff. No, that isn't balance.

As for making flasks work with the other weapon types, I agree that melee lacks the weaponry to inflict debuffs. But in all honesty, the only useful debuff anyone would use is ichor, and melee can easily use Golden Shower or Guns with ichor bullets themselves.

Taking things into account however, magic(Blizzard Staff, Razorpine, Crystal Storm) and ranged weapons(Tsunami, high-speed guns + crystal) have more options to break the piercing's limit of 6 hits per second than melee, and as such giving them permanent ichor(the only useful debuff for combat) will leave melee in the dust.

Reasoning why high speed weapons benefit more from ichor.

For reasons stated, I'm fine leaving the flasks as is.

 

[DestroyerOfTheDestroyer]

We do agree that summoners could use some debuff-applying weapons, though, right? Mini Spazmatism would be a good candidate for Cursed Flames.

 

[neoselket]

What you're proposing is even more unfair than the OP's suggestion. Ichor is pretty much the best debuff you've listed there. Ichor as it is now, benefits weapons that can hit more per second than a high damage weapon that hits slow. And guess which weapon group usually has the highest hit per second ratio? Ranged weapons. Especially true with guns + crystal bullets. And with Tsunami, 5 hits per use. Give a permanent ichor to ranged weapons, you're pretty much reducing the other weapon types to rabble.

And the currently weakest class you've given the most useless debuff. No, that isn't balance.

As for making flasks work with the other weapon types, I agree that melee lacks the weaponry to inflict debuffs. But in all honesty, the only useful debuff anyone would use is ichor, and melee can easily use Golden Shower or Guns with ichor bullets themselves.

Taking things into account however, magic(Blizzard Staff, Razorpine, Crystal Storm) and ranged weapons(Tsunami, high-speed guns + crystal) have more options to break the piercing's limit of 6 hits per second than melee, and as such giving them permanent ichor(the only useful debuff for combat) will leave melee in the dust.

Reasoning why high speed weapons benefit more from ichor.

For reasons stated, I'm fine leaving the flasks as is.

woah! that was just an example. i was just trying to illustrate my point. i chose random flasks for each class type, i wasn't saying it definatly had to be that way. and i understand how ichor works extremely well for rapid-fire weapons, but we already have ichor bullets, and so even if ichor was made ranged-only, which i only suggested as an example, it wouldn't change much.