Weapons & Equip Making the worst weapon type in the game viable + Helping Melee progression out a bit.

Do you agree with these changes?


  • Total voters
    28
So looking at this video it seems one of the Combat wrench's advantageous traits which helps it out other than its piercing ability it seems another angle of approach would perhaps be to generally increase boomerang speed? Interesting well this will suck for the mechanic but I think I might need this for my collection. :p
what's nice about the combat wrench is that when you hit something with instead of immediatly returning to you is slows and stops for a bit before returning to the player, this means it will almost always hit whatever you're attinkg twice, and if you have multiple enemies clumped up it will hit them all
 
what's nice about the combat wrench is that when you hit something with instead of immediately returning to you is slows and stops for a bit before returning to the player, this means it will almost always hit whatever you're attinkg twice, and if you have multiple enemies clumped up it will hit them all
Yeah I noticed that personally I would give the multi target piercing/slow return effect to the Thorn Chakram but I still think the launch and return speed are very important components to their lower viability which could be applied to all boomerangs prehardmode where as the piercing multi hit effect should only be given to later tier prehardmode boomerangs.
 
So looking at this video it seems one of the Combat wrench's advantageous traits which helps it out other than its piercing ability it seems another angle of approach would perhaps be to generally increase boomerang speed? Interesting well this will suck for the mechanic but I think I might need this for my collection. :p
Yes, Combat Wrench has 50% higher speed than Flamarang. If they at least increase boomerang speed across the board, that would make this type of weapon a lot more viable. But as I'm progressing through the game (currently pre-Golem), I find that stacking and piercing would really help. And we are definitely lacking an endgame boomerang. Paladin Hammer and Possessed Hatchet both lack real endgame qualities. If they were instead combined into one boomerang, with piercing and speed of the hammer and homing and stacking of the hatchet, plus a bit higher base damage, - then it would be usable. Not broken like Zenith, but tuned closer to Terrarian, with lower overall damage but extra utility.
 
EDIT 23/06/2020: Looking back, i'm not sure if I like this idea anymore.


Right now, two of the problems with Terraria's game progression are that:

  • All pre Hardmode Boomerang weapons are the definition of useless, while Hardmode ones are just ok but outclassed.
  • Most pre Hardmode Melee weapons are unviable for bosses, while those that are tend to be worse than what the other classes get.

Have you ever opened a Golden Chest Underground hoping for some sick Hermes Boots or a Magic Mirror, only to be disappointed by an Enchanted Boomerang you will never use? Feels bad, and that's because you just got a terrible weapon that is only ever useful for killing annoying Bats or Granite Elementals, and it's not even good at that since if you miss the throw you are basically defenseless until it comes back. And did I mention that this is one of the best weapons for pure Melee Eye of Cthulhu, with other options being grindy (Rally) or requiring you to somewhat break progression (Amazon, Starfury)?

And the same is true for the rest of all Boomerangs, none of them are never worth using because they are all that awful. So, how do we fix this? With a new accessory, of course.

Kylie Glove
18% increased Melee Velocity.
Allows Boomerangs to be thrown successively.
Recipe: 6 Leather at a Loom. [Leather would now cost 2 Rotten Chunks/Vertebrae, otherwise this would be impossible to get in Crimson and a massive grindfest in Corruption]

You know what made the Possessed Hatchet go from useless to decent in 1.3? The successive throwing. This item would give all Boomerangs the same buff, without making it too easily obtained. And even if this is a big buff to Boomerangs, the fact that it requires evil biome materials means you would have to know what you are doing before getting it; 12 Rotten Chunks/Vertabrae aren't exactly easy to obtain. That extra Melee Velocity also gives Boomerangs a bit more "oomph" while also making it somewhat useful when not using them. This would also gives Leather a new use, because I legit had to Google what it is actually used for right now.

Q: How would this work with Light Discs or Bananarangs?

A: 1-Their unique stacking mechanic would be removed.
2- They would work the exact same way as they do now and this item changes nothing.

Q: How would this affect the Possessed Hatchet and Paladin's Hammer?

A: It wouldn't. They are already thrown in succession.

So, even if the Enchanted and Ice Boomerangs would suddenly become good Melee weapons against EoC now, but there are still problems to fix. First, Melee still doesn't have a lot to use against the Eater of Worlds and Brain of Cthulhu. And second, the next step in Boomerang progression is the Thorn Chakram, and having to sit with an Enchanted Boomerang as your best weapon until that point isn't fun. And third, your main weapon still comes from a Chest, and being forced to look for those just to get a passable weapon isn't too fun.

The solution to these problems is easy, adding some more Boomerangs.

View attachment 227662View attachment 227663 Silver/Tungsten Boomerang (Sprites by @BluStryke)

10 (Silver)/11(Tungsten) Melee damage
4% Critical Strike Chance
Strong Knockback (7/8)
Very fast attack speed (15 use time)
10 Velocity
Recipe: 10 Silver/Tungsten at an Anvil.
An inbetween to the Wooden and the Enchanted Boomerangs that also gives Silver and Tungsten some more love.

View attachment 227665 Soul Bouncer (Sprite by @BluStryke)
19 Melee damage
4% Critical Strike Chance
Very Strong Knockback (9)
Very fast attack speed (15 use time)
15 Velocity
Recipe: 11 Demonite Bars at an Anvil.

A very fast Disc Boomerang with the ability to bounce off enemies and walls, think Shadowflame Knife mixed with Thorn Chrakram. That ricochet ability will work wonders on the Eater of Worlds underground.

View attachment 227664Spine Breaker (Sprite by @BluStryke)
20 Melee damage
4% Critical Strike Chance
Strong Knockback (7.5)
Very fast attack speed (15 use time)
10 Velocity
Recipe: 11 Crimtane at an Anvil.

Instead of ricocheting, this Glaive will pierce through 2 enemies instead. Excellent for the Brain of Cthulhu, remember how Boomerangs pierce infinitely on the way back.

So there we have it. With the new Kylie Glove and these new Boomerangs, there are finally enough of them throughout the entirety of phm to call them a viable weapon type, and now Melee would have good weapons for almost every pHM Boss without relying on Yoyos for everything.

The keyword there is "Almost", because Wall of Flesh is still a problem.

If you ever try to beat Expert WOF as a Melee character, you will realize that your best strategy is to not try and beat Expert WOF as a Melee character. The only weapon that is even close to being viable is the Beekeeper, and that still requires you to exploit some of the Wall's attributes, such as it never despawning off screen, or the Hungries not going through blocks. And as cool as the Kylie Glove might be with the Flamarang, you are not going to break through the Hungries with that..

My proposed solution is simple: another buff to Boomerangs, but this time it's an indirect one by adding something to a certain Melee accessory that also needs some love.

Magma Stone
Melee weapons inflict On Fire!
Melee weapons now pierce two extra enemies.
You know how Boomerangs pierce infinitely on their way back? Well, trying to exploit that is much harder than it sounds, but with this change to the Magma Stone that won't be a problem. With the way the Wall of Flesh works, not only would the Flamarang easily break through the wall of Hungries, it would also be able hit it multiple times, since it would sit on its Eyes/Mouth for an acceptably long time.

This change would obviously carry over to the Fire Gauntlet, a very welcome change since currently it's one of the only accessory upgrades in the game that is worse than the component. There are quite a few mediocre melee weapons that would definitely love the extra pierce (Chain Guillotines, Golem Fist, Daybreak).


BONUS HARDMODE ROUND
Bananarangs
Drop rate increased to 50% from 3,3%
I don't think anyone has ever used this weapon in a normal run. Hell, I don't think anyone even has 10 of these.

Wilderness Hunting Kit
Minor increases to offensive stats [+6% Damage and Crit, +18% velocity, +7 armor penetration]
Allows Boomerangs to be thrown successively.
Enemies are less likely to target you.
Recipe: Kylie Glove + Shark Tooth Necklace + Putrid Scent.
Because no item should ever be left without a tinker.

Sanguinary Hive
Releases life stealing Blood Hornets and increases movement speed when damaged.
Defense increased by 7.
Enemies are more likely to target you.
Recipe: Flesh Knuckles + Sweetheart Necklace

Unrelated to the topic, but since the Putrid Scent is part of a new recipe it's only fair to give something to the Flesh Knuckles as well. Spawns 4-6 Blood Hornets, which won't deal much damage (30-35), but will heal a tiny bit (10% of dealt damage) if they hit.
Bionic Boomer Bonus points if you get the reference.
Allows you to simultaneously throw two different Boomerangs.
Boomerangs inflict Electrified [Represented by a sparking effect]
Sold by the Cyborg for 1 Platinum after the Martian Madness has been defeated.

Even if the Possessed Hatchet and the Paladin's Hammer are decent on their own, they get outclassed pretty quickly by other Post Golem melee weapons (Influx Waver, Eye of Cthulhu, Flairon). This item allows you to use both of them at once, something that not only implements Boomerangs to the Pre Pillar tier, it also gives Melee another solid endgame weapon. That 16 DOT does nothing at this point in the game, so think of that as a visual effect meant to trick your eyes into thinking they are dealing more damage than before. Cyborg really needs to sell something else.


So what do you think? Would this make you use Boomerangs more often? Does this change nothing and Boomerangs are still awful? Did I go overboard and make them broken? Let me know what you think.
damn!!!
 
Bananarangs
Drop rate increased to 50% from 3,3%I don't think anyone has ever used this weapon in a normal run. Hell, I don't think anyone even has 10 of these.
Feel my pain. Just yesterday finished 20 blood moon events and got my 10 stack of Bananarangs complete at Clown #90!!!!
This is insane considering how tough these are and that they can oneshot your character even with 600 life and endgame gear in master mode.
It begins at around 3min into the vid.
 
Feel my pain. Just yesterday finished 20 blood moon events and got my 10 stack of Bananarangs complete at Clown #90!!!!
This is insane considering how tough these are and that they can oneshot your character even with 600 life and endgame gear in master mode.
It begins at around 3min into the vid.

Incredible dedication again but... was it really needed? Couldnt you have used Sargeant united shield or even flying knife on destroyer?

This is also getting off-topic, btw
 
Just giving the piercing property to most non-chakram type boomerangs would make them much better.
 
awesome idea, though i think 50% drop rate is a bit too much for the bananarang. What about 25%?



also:


spine breaker.png


demon wind shuriken.png
 
maybye it could just be to where the bannarang is no longer stackable but the 1 bannarang acts just like 10, that way if you're lucky enough to get 1 bannarang you're done. The issue with the bannanarang isn't just that it's rare but that you need to get multiple of them to be any good.
 
Incredible dedication again but... was it really needed? Couldnt you have used Sargeant united shield or even flying knife on destroyer?

This is also getting off-topic, btw
You are right, Sergeant united shield is very good against the destroyer. But Bananarangs have an advantage over light discs. More damage and range if using 10 vs 5 discs. I used bananas to beat plantera and it was fast.
 
You are right, Sergeant united shield is very good against the destroyer. But Bananarangs have an advantage over light discs. More damage and range if using 10 vs 5 discs. I used bananas to beat plantera and it was fast.
Wait so Light disks a Post Mech weapon are inferior to Bananarangs? By how much exactly? I don't know how I feel about that..... Personally it doesn't sound very reasonable even if a full stack of 10 is so hard to get.... I have never been a fan of tying rarity to power... Oh well to get this back on topic any suggestions you have for how Boomerangs could be improved?
 
Wait so Light disks a Post Mech weapon are inferior to Bananarangs? By how much exactly? I don't know how I feel about that..... Personally it doesn't sound very reasonable even if a full stack of 10 is so hard to get.... I have never been a fan of tying rarity to power... Oh well to get this back on topic any suggestions you have for how Boomerangs could be improved?

Bananarangs x10 are definitely stronger than Light Discs x5, both single and multiple targets. They are faster and reach further. But they lack the ricocheting ability of the Light Discs, which makes the latter better suited for some situations, such as Dungeon explorations. Still both are lacking piercing and homing abilities.

Well, after having [almost] completed Master mode playthrough using boomerangs only (only Moonlord is left to do) and tested all of them, this would be my wish list:

Pre-Hardmode:

* All boomerangs should have higher speed, otherwise they are all useless except for the combat wrench
* All boomerangs would benefit from some piercing and stacking
* There should be at least one more tier above the combat wrench, with stacking, higher range and higher base damage. Being forced to build an arena across the entire [large] world to beat the Wall of Flesh is ridiculous, especially when every other class has multiple good options.

Hardmode:

* Higher drop rate for Bananarangs would greatly help. They are pretty decent against the Twins, Prime and Plantera even in Master mode
* Sergeant United Shield is great against the Destroyer and helps in some situations when homing is needed but without stacking it's only good very early on.
* Light discs are only useful in tight places like the Dungeon, but other than that lack both the damage and range of the Banarangs
* Paladin's Hammer is somewhat usable when piercing is a must but lacks range and homing unfortunately.
* Possessed Hatchet is my top pick due to its homing and relatively fast speed. Though it's lacking in the damage and piercing department.
* We have NO endgame boomerangs. This could be fixed with another tier that combines the functionality of the Possessed Hatched and Paladin's Hammer. It would also have to have higher base damage to even reach the lower end of the acceptable level for endgame.

All in all, it is a very nice weapon class but not finalized and not really endgame viable. Good for a fun challenge though.
 
Bananarangs x10 are definitely stronger than Light Discs x5, both single and multiple targets. They are faster and reach further. But they lack the ricocheting ability of the Light Discs, which makes the latter better suited for some situations, such as Dungeon explorations. Still both are lacking piercing and homing abilities.

Well, after having [almost] completed Master mode playthrough using boomerangs only (only Moonlord is left to do) and tested all of them, this would be my wish list:

Pre-Hardmode:

* All boomerangs should have higher speed, otherwise they are all useless except for the combat wrench
* All boomerangs would benefit from some piercing and stacking
* There should be at least one more tier above the combat wrench, with stacking, higher range and higher base damage. Being forced to build an arena across the entire [large] world to beat the Wall of Flesh is ridiculous, especially when every other class has multiple good options.

Hardmode:

* Higher drop rate for Bananarangs would greatly help. They are pretty decent against the Twins, Prime and Plantera even in Master mode
* Sergeant United Shield is great against the Destroyer and helps in some situations when homing is needed but without stacking it's only good very early on.
* Light discs are only useful in tight places like the Dungeon, but other than that lack both the damage and range of the Banarangs
* Paladin's Hammer is somewhat usable when piercing is a must but lacks range and homing unfortunately.
* Possessed Hatchet is my top pick due to its homing and relatively fast speed. Though it's lacking in the damage and piercing department.
* We have NO endgame boomerangs. This could be fixed with another tier that combines the functionality of the Possessed Hatched and Paladin's Hammer. It would also have to have higher base damage to even reach the lower end of the acceptable level for endgame.

All in all, it is a very nice weapon class but not finalized and not really endgame viable. Good for a fun challenge though.
Great insights it might be a good idea to bring these points up in the 1.4 balance discussion as many involve the adjustment of existing items thus are things we might be able to reasonably see implemented.
 
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