(SPOILERS) Final Boss seems impossible now.

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totallydeadaccountdude

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I feel like the devs balanced the Moon Lord for EXPERT mode, and not Normal mode.
Every update they seem to add some form of unreasonable buff to the Moon Lord which further makes him more frustrating and annoying to fight.
Being unable to use Campfires, Heart Lanterns, Honey, or whatever various HP regen items is just a bit TOO much. Same thing with Lifesteal.
But the inability to escape the Moon Lord makes it RIDICULOUS. The fight can't be practiced consistiently because you need to go through the (INCREDIBLY HARD) Cultist & Solar Pillars AGAIN after every kill/death.

So the devs either need to find a way to make moon lord summoning faster post-fighting it once, or return it to how it was pre-patches.
 
For the record, lifesteal is the only healing disabled during the Moon Lord fight (at least as of now, it would not surprise me if healing is eventually blocked completely given current trends).
I do agree with your sentiments though. We have Expert Mode now, and many people complaining that the Moon Lord is too hard. If he must be buffed, those buffs should be kept in Expert Mode-- it's there to provide a greater challenge.
Plus, the buffs he's getting feeling incredibly clumsy. They're just blatant bans on certain strategies, with no rhyme or reason. No warning either-- the Moon Lord crushed me easily my first fight because I foolishly failed to predict that my Vampire Knives would in fact not heal me like they always had.
And yes, having to slog through the Lunar Event for each Moon Lord fight is really annoying, especially given that I know I'm more likely than not to die and have to start over.

Thankfully, I've finally collected all his drops and made everything out of Luminite (and have a huge supply to craft ammo), so I no longer have to deal with him.
 
So the Moon Lord prepatch was the only boss that you could use the nurse (safely) for in the middle of the fight. The rest despawned if you magic mirror'd across the world or just outright killed you (Wall of Flesh). I see this is making the game more internally consistent. Besides, you can still use the nurse, you just have to quickly leave before he massacres your NPC town after.

The devs seem to want a "fair fight" and are removing as many cheese methods as they can. You can argue the details of "if it's in the game, it's legitimate" until the cows come home, but ultimately the developers don't see it that way and it's ultimately up to them whether they want the final boss to one fought with careful timing and dodging or fought with facetanking with life regen/teleporting to spawn every 15 seconds.
 
Orangemm said:
I feel like the devs balanced the Moon Lord for EXPERT mode, and not Normal mode.
Every update they seem to add some form of unreasonable buff to the Moon Lord which further makes him more frustrating and annoying to fight.
Being unable to use Campfires, Heart Lanterns, Honey, or whatever various HP regen items is just a bit TOO much. Same thing with Lifesteal.
But the inability to escape the Moon Lord makes it RIDICULOUS. The fight can't be practiced consistiently because you need to go through the (INCREDIBLY HARD) Cultist & Solar Pillars AGAIN after every kill/death.

So the devs either need to find a way to make moon lord summoning faster post-fighting it once, or return it to how it was pre-patches.
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"Certain strategies"
You mean completely exploiting the fight and using god mode armor to make him, like every other boss, a walk in the park? I for one am glad that it's gone, as the fight shouldn't just be "stand still and win" or "nurse spam with no chance of failure to win". He being to hard is just from what he used to be, exploited and easily beaten, and not a final boss. Normal mode shouldn't turn into Easy Mide either, and new changes to make certain things harder shouldn't be just made for Expert, as Normal mode is still meant to be somewhat challenging.
 
azumarill64 said:
"Certain strategies"
You mean completely exploiting the fight and using god mode armor to make him, like every other boss, a walk in the park? I for one am glad that it's gone, as the fight shouldn't just be "stand still and win" or "nurse spam with no chance of failure to win". He being to hard is just from what he used to be, exploited and easily beaten, and not a final boss. Normal mode shouldn't turn into Easy Mide either, and new changes to make certain things harder shouldn't be just made for Expert, as Normal mode is still meant to be somewhat challenging.
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LIfesteal does NOT make you a god. Life steal is incredibly weak, all it does is help the player.
This change to the boss KILLS playstyles.
 
Orangemm said:
LIfesteal does NOT make you a god. Life steal is incredibly weak, all it does is help the player.
This change to the boss KILLS playstyles.
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No, actually it just kills mirroring back to the nurse or trying to disengage the boss for whatever reason. I can't really think of any other reason to disengage from a boss prematurely aside from running out of ammo or running and trying to wait out potion sickness.
 
azumarill64 said:
I love Expert Mode. It takes all those easy, neglected bosses and turns them into hulking abominations thar pose a serious threat to your existence.
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Ikr. I'm still trying to find a solution to killing Wall of Flesh. I will probably regret going into Hardmode.
 
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azumarill64 said:
I love Expert Mode. It takes all those easy, neglected bosses and turns them into hulking abominations thar pose a serious threat to your existence.
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Except EoW... i still was able to face tank him, spamming the harpoon to the floor and heal of the heart drops. Granted, i had to use potions now but still... Hillariously easy of a boss.
 
I might have found a new kind of "exploit" against him, but I'm currently not home. So I cannot test it yet.
Can anyone tell me, if the Laser of his passes through Tiles?
 
azumarill64 said:
"Certain strategies"
You mean completely exploiting the fight and using god mode armor to make him, like every other boss, a walk in the park? I for one am glad that it's gone, as the fight shouldn't just be "stand still and win" or "nurse spam with no chance of failure to win". He being to hard is just from what he used to be, exploited and easily beaten, and not a final boss. Normal mode shouldn't turn into Easy Mide either, and new changes to make certain things harder shouldn't be just made for Expert, as Normal mode is still meant to be somewhat challenging.
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I'm sorry, last time I checked this game was about progression. You upgrade your armor and/or weapons to better handle what you're up against. Why should someone who worked hard for their gear be forced to limit themselves. You can get a vampire knife long before you fight any of the cultists and you can use it on any boss after you have it. Now suddenly you're telling that person they can't, that breaks the game rules. The boss should have been designed with these weapons in mind instead of the devs just trying to lazily remedy the method. You're already 2-3 shot in expert hardmode after the jungle or in eclipses. The game is pretty damn punishing as a whole, and lets be honest. Your mobility to evade attacks from bosses was never that great. You have jungle bats that are super tiny doing 100 damage and they follow you all damn day. You've got hornets that shoot tiny microscopic pellets that can absolutely shred you. The game as a whole is difficult enough, we don't need any more arbitrary additions.
 
azumarill64 said:
Nope, but some of his other attacks do.
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I can't even remember some of his attacks, as the laser was the only thing that was killing me ( and my friends)
You can avoid it, but it gets impossible to dodge as soon the second eye starts shooting them as well.

That Laser deals around 340 Damage to me on Expert, so if I got that out of the way, I'm very positive I can kill him.
 
Evan20000 said:
I see this is making the game more internally consistent.
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And the arbitrary removal of lifesteal makes it less internally consistent-- see above, where I mentioned how my first fight with the Moon Lord ended in disaster because I had the temerity to expect my gear to work the same way it always had.

The devs seem to want a "fair fight" and are removing as many cheese methods as they can. You can argue the details of "if it's in the game, it's legitimate" until the cows come home, but ultimately the developers don't see it that way and it's ultimately up to them whether they want the final boss to one fought with careful timing and dodging or fought with facetanking with life regen/teleporting to spawn every 15 seconds.
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My question is, if they didn't want these, why did they work in the first place? The teleporting to spawn thing is the big curiosity here-- as you said, all other bosses despawn if you do that. I find it hard to believe that they would have simply forgotten to make it despawn (and the new change doesn't even make it despawn). Maybe they just didn't consider people using that strategy, but lifesteal is a blindingly obvious strategy, especially for mages who would be in Spectre armor anyway.
It really does feel like they're going "Oh, people are using things put into the game to beat the Moon Lord? Better put a stop to that!"
 
The only problem I have with Moon Lord is how long it takes to refight him again. It will take a normal player several attempts to learn the boss (as you can die very fast) so it's just too punishing to have to go through the cultist and pillars again for a loss. Maybe for if you want more Moon Lord drops you have to do it again, but not for a loss.. it's too punishing.

Also, try chlorophyte bullets, razorblade typhoon, or something else that homes.

Orangemm said:
LIfesteal does NOT make you a god. Life steal is incredibly weak, all it does is help the player.
This change to the boss KILLS playstyles.
Click to expand...
azumarill64 said:
Can someone fetch @Snickerbobble's (least I think it was him) gif of him standing in a swarm of Pumpkings with Lifesteal and barely suffering a scratch?
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jwlHW5C.gif


I think there shouldn't be a Moon Bite debuff and they should just fix the lifesteal system. The fact that the only two items that cause it are negated in this battle kind of shows the devs find lifesteal too powerful as well.
 
Snickerbobble said:
The only problem I have with Moon Lord is how long it takes to refight him again. It will take a normal player several attempts to learn the boss (as you can die very fast) so it's just too punishing to have to go through the cultist and pillars again for a loss. Maybe for if you want more Moon Lord drops you have to do it again, but not for a loss.. it's too punishing.
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This can't be said enough. The iteration time on Moon Lord is too high, and it requires too much effort and repetition. The Lunar Event is fun the first few times, but it quickly becomes a grind.

I think there shouldn't be a Moon Bite debuff and they should just fix the lifesteal system. The fact that the only two items that cause it are negated in this battle kind of shows the devs find lifesteal too powerful as well.
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I am in full agreement here, as much as I enjoy lifesteal. Moon Bite is just a bandage on something that's heavily impacting lategame balance.
 
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