Weapons & Equip Martian conduit armor

[The Rope God🌳]

I'm struggling to put it into words, but something about this suggestion rubs me the wrong way. I disagree with it in concept; Martian Conduit Plating is far from a useless block. It looks good and has a great furniture set. I also disagree with the idea that there isn't already a reason to not go straight to Cultist after fighting Golem; we have Duke Fishron, Empress of Light, the Frost/Pumpkin Moon, and of course everything else that already drops from Martian Madness. I know some of that is technically post-Plantera, but it's more balanced around post-Golem. But none of that really has to do with the actual meat of the suggestion. Unfortunately, I don't like that either, but again, I'm not really sure why. If I can figure out what about it bothers me, I'll come back and form some proper criticism, because right now all I can do is complain aimlessly, and that helps nobody.

I will say that if this event was going to have an armor set, I would rather it be class-specific, instead of options for every class. Currently, only Summoner and Melee get two armor sets after Plantera; why not have this Martian Conduit Armor be a Ranged set that's an upgrade from (or alternative to) Shroomite?

Alright,
If it looks good and has a furniture set, thats basically a practically useless block.

What do you mean that Summoner and melee have 2 armor sets post plantera, Tiki and spooky,
Beetle and....?
Spooky armor is better than tiki, but that aside,
I was talking about this being an alternative to Post golem armor on a usually overlooked event due to its difficulty and the fact that pillar weapons can be achieved 20 minutes after defeating golem. There really is no reason to do anything Post golem because there are much stronger weapons in reach.

 

[Big Sammich]

Alright,
If it looks good and has a furniture set, thats basically a practically useless block.

Hard disagree. Also, you don't get to decide if a block is useless or not.

What do you mean that Summoner and melee have 2 armor sets post plantera, Tiki and spooky,
Beetle and....?
Spooky armor is better than tiki, but that aside,
I was talking about this being an alternative to Post golem armor on a usually overlooked event due to its difficulty and the fact that pillar weapons can be achieved 20 minutes after defeating golem. There really is no reason to do anything Post golem because there are much stronger weapons in reach.

I was talking about Turtle armor, which is not actually post-Plantera, but considering how many other armor options there are between the mechs and Plantera, I tend to think of it as post-Plantera because that's where I go after it. And there not being a reason to do anything post-Golem is not a problem with the game, it's a problem with how YOU play the game. You can very, very easily slow down and do the optional stuff, play the events, and get the stepping stone gear. You never have to go straight for the strongest thing available to you. You have effectively decided the in-game solution to a problem that not everyone has isn't good enough, and you have designed this armor as a solution... except it's not actually a solution, because the existing on-tier armor sets are good enough that you will still have an easy enough time skipping Martian Madness and getting the Pillar weapons to not need to go after this. People who skip the optional stuff between Golem and Cultist will continue to do that, and people who don't do that don't need any extra encouragement.

 

[The Rope God🌳]

Hard disagree. Also, you don't get to decide if a block is useless or not.

What is that supposed to mean? A block that can be placed is actually supposed to be useful? Not in the slightest. At this point in the game, you don't need yet another placeable decoration.

I was talking about Turtle armor, which is not actually post-Plantera, but considering how many other armor options there are between the mechs and Plantera, I tend to think of it as post-Plantera because that's where I go after it.

Wait, i edited this, i misunderstood.
What other armor sets are post mech?

And there not being a reason to do anything post-Golem is not a problem with the game, it's a problem with how YOU play the game. You can very, very easily slow down and do the optional stuff, play the events, and get the stepping stone gear.

See, that's the reason why im suggesting this. There is literally no reason to do absolutely anything post golem, besides crafting your armor set.

You never have to go straight for the strongest thing available to you.

Sure, if you like being weak

You have effectively decided the in-game solution to a problem that not everyone has isn't good enough,

And what is this in game solution? A bunch of optional events?

and you have designed this armor as a solution... except it's not actually a solution, because the existing on-tier armor sets are good enough that you will still have an easy enough time skipping Martian Madness and getting the Pillar weapons to not need to go after this.

Yes, and I designed this to be a viable alternative to post golem armor sets.

People who skip the optional stuff between Golem and Cultist will continue to do that, and people who don't do that don't need any extra encouragement.

Alright, and I can't control that.


The whole point of this suggestion is to make Martian conduct plating more similar to Spooky wood instead of just another placeable block.
The very few people that actually use the block can just place it, and everyone else just forgets about it or trashes it.

 

[Big Sammich]

What is that supposed to mean? A block that can be placed is actually supposed to be useful? Not in the slightest. At this point in the game, you don't need yet another placeable decoration.

It means that saying a block must be more than just decorative to be "useful" is a very shortsighted way of viewing the game.

Wait, i edited this, i misunderstood.
What other armor sets are post mech?

Hallowed and Chlorophyte are the ones that come to mind, but you could easily also use Frost or Forbidden. That's 3 different armor sets for each class, except for Summoner, which gets 2. Because of that, I tend not to go for Turtle armor until post-Plantera, because I want to use other options first.

See, that's the reason why im suggesting this. There is literally no reason to do absolutely anything post golem, besides crafting your armor set.

What on Earth are you talking about? There are no less than 4 events and 2 optional bosses, all of which provide powerful gear for every class. Razorblade Typhoon, Starlight, Aerial Bane, Laser Machinegun, Snowman Cannon, Horseman's Blade, Eventide, Bubble Gun, Spooky Armor, Cosmic Car Key, Flying Dragon, Dark Harvest, Horseman's Blade, Tsunami... need I go on? Even if these weapons are outclassed by other ones, they are still options you can get. You don't need to always use the most powerful option. But you say:

Sure, if you like being weak

Which is a highly judgmental and limited way of looking at things. Not only do several of these optional things provide you with weapons that contend with the Pillar weapons, but they also function differently, providing you with variety and more interesting strategies. In your mind, are "being weak" and "not performing at maximum capacity" the same thing?

And what is this in game solution? A bunch of optional events?

Yes, precisely. The game invites you to play more of the game, engage with new and different enemies and mechanics, try out other options. If you explore a little bit, you can find more to do. Why is this not enough for you? Do you want the game to force you to do these things?

Yes, and I designed this to be a viable alternative to post golem armor sets.

Except, for the reasons I stated before, that does not actually solve this "problem." All you've done is add more optional content, which is baffling to me because your whole stance is that the optional content isn't as good as the next step of required progression.

Alright, and I can't control that.

The whole point of this suggestion is to make Martian conduct plating more similar to Spooky wood instead of just another placeable block.
The very few people that actually use the block can just place it, and everyone else just forgets about it or trashes it.

I still don't understand why you see this as a problem. Building and decorating is a big part of the game, and there's tons of stuff that's only good for builders. Everything else in Martian Madness is combat-oriented. Can we not just have one thing that isn't?

 

[The Rope God🌳]

It means that saying a block must be more than just decorative to be "useful" is a very shortsighted way of viewing the game.

Maybe it is, but "can be placed" isn't any more useful than dirt to someone who focuses on combat, like me.

Hallowed and Chlorophyte are the ones that come to mind, but you could easily also use Frost or Forbidden. That's 3 different armor sets for each class, except for Summoner, which gets 2. Because of that, I tend not to go for Turtle armor until post-Plantera, because I want to use other options first.

Ah, thanks.

What on Earth are you talking about? There are no less than 4 events and 2 optional bosses, all of which provide powerful gear for every class. Razorblade Typhoon, Starlight, Aerial Bane, Laser Machinegun, Snowman Cannon, Horseman's Blade, Eventide, Bubble Gun, Spooky Armor, Cosmic Car Key, Flying Dragon, Dark Harvest, Horseman's Blade, Tsunami... need I go on? Even if these weapons are outclassed by other ones, they are still options you can get. You don't need to always use the most powerful option. But you say:

("Yes, if you like being weak" was quoted here)
And they can all just be removed because why do any of this when you can just get pillar weapons.

Which is a highly judgmental and limited way of looking at things. Not only do several of these optional things provide you with weapons that contend with the Pillar weapons, but they also function differently, providing you with variety and more interesting strategies.

The Razorblade typhoon, the Betsy loot and Maybe the kaleidoscope are the only ones that compare to Pillar loot.

In your mind, are "being weak" and "not performing at maximum capacity" the same thing?

Yes.

Yes, precisely. The game invites you to play more of the game, engage with new and different enemies and mechanics, try out other options. If you explore a little bit, you can find more to do. Why is this not enough for you? Do you want the game to force you to do these things?

Yes!
The entire post golem is irrelevant, like the "gap" between golem and Plantera. You get some completely optional content that is easily overlooked in progression.
I have never done T3 OOA, and I can't tell you the last time I gave EoL a real attempt.

Except, for the reasons I stated before, that does not actually solve this "problem." All you've done is add more optional content, which is baffling to me because your whole stance is that the optional content isn't as good as the next step of required progression.

I still don't understand why you see this as a problem. Building and decorating is a big part of the game, and there's tons of stuff that's only good for builders. Everything else in Martian Madness is combat-oriented. Can we not just have one thing that isn't?

Everything in the Pumpkin moon is combat oriented.
Besides, can't Conduit plating be both good decorative and good combat material?

We aren't getting anywhere with this. If you want to add to It, you can, but I feel like carrying this on is unnecessary.
Also, Is your only problem with this the fact that there is already enough of stuff in this point of the game, or am I missing your point?

 

[J Bame]

Conduit headset (Summoner)
2 defense
+10% summon damage
+2 minion slots
Set bonus:
+2 minion slots
+15% summon damage
A tesla appears above your head that shoots fast moving electricity at enemies every 2 seconds, giving them the electrified debuff. It deals 70 summon damage, and will absorb a hit, getting destroyed and giving you +20% movement speed for 5 seconds, reappearing after 10 seconds.

Almost the same stats as Tiki armor, shadow dodge with a 10 second cooldown, and a decent DoT debuff on top of it all. This armor is op as hell.

Conduit visor set (ranged)
+12 defense
+22% ranged crit chance
+5% ranged damage
Set bonus:
Bullets have a slight homing effect and will bounce off blocks, as well as inflicting the electrified debuff to enemies.
Arrows will smart bounce off blocks 3 times, at the cost of being slower.
Non-conventional ammo will inflict electrified and move faster

Shroomite has very very good stats, but to compensate it practically doesnt have a set bonus. This has similar stats to shroomite with an actual set bonus.

This set bonus turns every arrow into a much better chlorophyte arrow, lowering velocity of arrows doesnt matter at all if you are going to give them 3 more chances to hit with no damage penalty. Giving any sort homing to all bullets is a very dangerous idea given how strong Chlorophyte bullets are, and Chlorophyte Bullets dont have any more power than Silver Bullets.

Also increases velocity and adds a DoT to all ammo worth using, for some reason. Again, busted as hell.

Conduit reactor (magic)
+8 defense
+12% magic damage
+ Heavily increased movement speed and acceleration
Set bonus:
+6% magic crit chance
You have a ~15 block aura that will pulse every 4 seconds, dealing some knockback and inflicting electrified. Magic attacks trigger this aura too, but to a much lesser extent.

This is the odd one out of the suggestion, this is just awfully underpowered on so many levels
- No mana at all, not even cost reductions
- Lower magic damage bonuses than Adamantite Magic armor, not even an OP set bonus like Spectre Mask's giving 400-800 DPS
- Set bonus seems to only knock back so the only effect on your DPS is getting a DoT. That much knockback may even get in your way when using Razorpine or anything else that hits rapidly, depending on how it's implemented
- Honestly why does it have +6% crit chance on the set bonus? That much is ridiculously low this late in the game
- Acceleration, while it can replace a dash and free up an accessory slot, is still worse than a dash, and the rest of the armor is terribly underpowered to compensate.

Conduit Blast helm (melee)
+28 defense
-5% melee damage
+10% melee speed
Set bonus:
+50% melee speed
-30% melee damage
Melee attacks will crackle with electricity, exploding upon a hit. But only the first hit, any pierce doesn't trigger this. The explosion deals 30% of your weapons base damage and inflicts moderate knockback and Electrified.
Melee attacks are much faster, but deal much less damage.
(Kinda encourages use of non- terra blade melee weapons )

Terra blade despite having a 25% melee speed penalty, actually gets more benefit from it since both the swings and the beams attack faster. All other swords only swing faster, with beams being unaffected. So if you lower damage and increase melee speed, you ruin the DPS of other Beams making Terra Blade the best by default. This is the opposite of your goal of encouraging using other melee weapons than terra blade.

Also this has a 1.3x damage multiplier on top of it all. That 1.3x alone is busted as hell and basically compensates for the damage loss.

 

[The Rope God🌳]

Almost the same stats as Tiki armor, shadow dodge with a 10 second cooldown, and a decent DoT debuff on top of it all. This armor is op as hell.

Interesting. I thought that a 10 second cooldown was actually too much, but I guess I was wrong.

Shroomite has very very good stats, but to compensate it practically doesnt have a set bonus. This has similar stats to shroomite with an actual set bonus.

This set bonus turns every arrow into a much better chlorophyte arrow, lowering velocity of arrows doesnt matter at all if you are going to give them 3 more chances to hit with no damage penalty.

Ive seen Clorophyte arrows, they really aren't that great IMO.
Even then, the lowered velocity lowers your chance to hit against ML, which is your only major challenge after this point.

Giving any sort homing to all bullets is a very dangerous idea given how strong Chlorophyte bullets are, and Chlorophyte Bullets dont have any more power than Silver Bullets.

Any sort?
Clorophyte bullets have the highest homing ive ever seen, on anything. Is giving a slight curve to bullets really that broken?

Also increases velocity and adds a DoT to all ammo worth using, for some reason. Again, busted as hell.

I meant ammo that isn't bullets or arrows.

This is the odd one out of the suggestion, this is just awfully underpowered on so many levels
- No mana at all, not even cost reductions

Ah, i forgot about that mana.

- Lower magic damage bonuses than Adamantite Magic armor, not even an OP set bonus like Spectre Mask's giving 400-800 DPS

Wait, really?
Huh.

- Set bonus seems to only knock back so the only effect on your DPS is getting a DoT. That much knockback may even get in your way when using Razorpine or anything else that hits rapidly, depending on how it's implemented

Thats a good point.

- Honestly why does it have +6% crit chance on the set bonus? That much is ridiculously low this late in the game

Should I raise it?

- Acceleration, while it can replace a dash and free up an accessory slot, is still worse than a dash, and the rest of the armor is terribly underpowered to compensate.

Huh.
Clearly this one needs a complete overhaul.

Terra blade despite having a 25% melee speed penalty, actually gets more benefit from it since both the swings and the beams attack faster. All other swords only swing faster, with beams being unaffected. So if you lower damage and increase melee speed, you ruin the DPS of other Beams making Terra Blade the best by default. This is the opposite of your goal of encouraging using other melee weapons than terra blade.

Also this has a 1.3x damage multiplier on top of it all. That 1.3x alone is busted as hell and basically compensates for the damage loss.

So i just countered my own goal with this one? That's not good.


Thank you for the criticism.
What should I do to balance these?

 

[J Bame]

Ive seen Clorophyte arrows, they really aren't that great IMO.

Chloro arrows have the second highest base damage and a pseudo-homing ability with Smart Bouncing. The smart bouncing has a 33% damage penalty and it can only happen once. You could say the penalty should be lower but that's about it, the arrow is fine, note that Ichor Arrows have the same stats and a ton of people still use those, Chloro arrows only trade the ichor debuff for the smart bouncing.

This gives arrows 3 bounces, no penalty, and lets them keep any special effects.

Even then, the lowered velocity lowers your chance to hit against ML, which is your only major challenge after this point.

pumpkin moon, frost moon, duke fishron, empress of light, old one's army, cultist, four pillars, grinding in preparation for the pillars...

Any sort?
Clorophyte bullets have the highest homing ive ever seen, on anything. Is giving a slight curve to bullets really that broken?

Chloro bullets without homing are just silver bullets. No damage multiplier, no pierce, nothing. Yet they are commonly regarded as the best bullets in the game, that is the power of homing

So you either give them the most meaningless curve in the history of mankind or you make all bullets much better.

I meant ammo that isn't bullets or arrows.

In that case be more creative than just "more velocity and DoT", everyone is going to stick to Shroomite helm

What should I do to balance these?

change the Tesla thing to be a 25% damage reduction or so with a longer cooldown

overhaul the mage one

swap the melee damage and melee speed penalties on the melee one, remove the 1.3x multiplier on single targets and make the ring only hit other enemies

nerf the stats on ranged one slightly and make the set bonus give Chloro arrow's mechanics to bullets and arrows equally

 

[The Rope God🌳]

Chloro arrows have the second highest base damage and a pseudo-homing ability with Smart Bouncing. The smart bouncing has a 33% damage penalty and it can only happen once. You could say the penalty should be lower but that's about it, the arrow is fine, note that Ichor Arrows have the same stats and a ton of people still use those, Chloro arrows only trade the ichor debuff for the smart bouncing.

This gives arrows 3 bounces, no penalty, and lets them keep any special effects.

Interesting
That is powerful.

pumpkin moon, frost moon, duke fishron, empress of light, old one's army, cultist, four pillars, grinding in preparation for the pillars...

I said major

Chloro bullets without homing are just silver bullets. No damage multiplier, no pierce, nothing. Yet they are commonly regarded as the best bullets in the game, that is the power of homing

So you either give them the most meaningless curve in the history of mankind or you make all bullets much better.

Im thinking it'll curve enough so that you hit if you're off by a few blocks, but won't just fly backwards to hit ene.

In that case be more creative than just "more velocity and DoT", everyone is going to stick to Shroomite helm

There's not much I can do to things like that.

change the Tesla thing to be a 25% damage reduction or so with a longer cooldown

That seems better, but longer cooldown? 10 seconds is a lot in combat.

overhaul the mage one

Ok

swap the melee damage and melee speed penalties on the melee one, remove the 1.3x multiplier on single targets and make the ring only hit other enemies

Alright...

nerf the stats on ranged one slightly and make the set bonus give Chloro arrow's mechanics to bullets and arrows equally

Seems good, i guess.

 

[J Bame]

I said major

That is not how this works

you dont disregard literally all of post golem just because you dont do it

 

[The Rope God🌳]

That is not how this works

you dont disregard literally all of post golem just because you dont do it

Im not disregarding it, im just saying its not an integral part of the game when I want it to be.
You don't have to do anything post golem, and I don't really like that.

BTW, i changed a few things about the helmets.

 

[TheForkG]

I actually really like this idea, I always wanted a reason to do Martian Madness other than the Car Keys and Influx Waver. The blocks are also fun to build with, so you can grind the blocks for more than just building.

 

[J Bame]

its not an integral part of the game when I want it to be.

You don't have to do anything post golem, and I don't really like that.

...and that's why you are ignoring Post Golem when balancing your items?

 

[The Rope God🌳]

...and that's why you are ignoring Post Golem when balancing your items?

How am ignoring post golem?
I balanced this around post golem armor sets

 

[thisisabadname]

I feel like this would work a lot better as a single class set

(Or maybe a 2 class hybrid set, mage ranger perhaps?)

The summoner stats you suggested are way too strong. Same with the melee stats.

 

[Holy Avocado 🌳]

I love this, I always randomly have Martian conduit plating laying around and taking up room in my chests with no real function (I’m not a big fan of the furniture set), but overall, this would give it a use.

 

[Yooples]

I think Martian conduit being used as a block is a little bit of wasted potential.
So I think that you should be able to make gear out of it.
I know it has to compete with post-golem armor, so Ill put that into consideration.

Conduit leggings:
15 defense
+ 8% movement speed and crit chance

Conduit chestplate:
17 defense
+10% damage
34 defense in total

There are different types of Helmets:

Conduit headset (Summoner)
2 defense
+10% summon damage
+2 minion slots
Set bonus:
+2 minion slots
+15% summon damage
A tesla appears above your head that shoots fast moving electricity at enemies every 2 seconds, giving them the electrified debuff. It deals 70 summon damage, and will reduce damage of a hit by 25%, getting destroyed and giving you +20% movement speed for 5 seconds, reappearing after 15 seconds.

Conduit visor set (ranged)
+12 defense
+18% ranged crit chance
+4% ranged damage
Set bonus:
Bullets and arrows will smart bounce off blocks, 3 times, dealing 25% damage and only inflicting Electrified before the first bounce.

Conduit reactor (magic)
+8 defense
+12% magic damage
+80 maximum mana
Set bonus:
+8% magic crit chance
-10% mana costs
Magic attacks will inflict a unique debuff called "radiated"(because its a reactor??) That increases your damage dealt to that target by 15%.
But hitting an enemy has a 1% chance to give you the debuff too
For every 40 mana you regen, you get 1 HP

Conduit Blast helm (melee)
+28 defense
-5% melee speed
+10% melee damage
Set bonus:
-50% melee speed
+50% melee damage
Melee attacks will be much slower, but hit much harder.
(Encourages the use of non Terra blade weapons)
Although this would make the Zenith incredibly broken, but that doesn't matter.

Crafting:
Chestplate: 200 conduit plating, 20 wires.
Leggings: 200 conduit plating, a teleporter.
Any helmet: 100 conduit plating.

Now, what would this add to the game?
1. An incentive to not immediately go to cultist post golem, and an incentive to do the Martian madness.
2. A viable alternative to the usually repetitive post golem armor progression.
3. A use for conduit plating, making it more like Spooky wood than just a useless block that you throw away or sell without a second thought.

This took quite a while, so please tell me your thoughts!
Edit: overhauled a few things at the request of @J Bame

this concept is insanely cool, I would really like this in the game, but melee helmet is broken

 

[Ferrin🌳]

honestly i really like the idea for the set, the theme, the use of martian madness, but why do we have to have a set for every class, like most of the problem are caused by it being set with helmet making up for every class.
Why just not choose one of the cool set variants and roll with that or even better why not make it a set that mixes different classes. Like we have forbiden armor for mage-summoner and frost armor for ranged - melee.
We could have two helmets that using strong set bonuses make it eighter melee - summoner or ranged - mage hybrid armor

 

[The Rope God🌳]

honestly i really like the idea for the set, the theme, the use of martian madness, but why do we have to have a set for every class, like most of the problem are caused by it being set with helmet making up for every class.
Why just not choose one of the cool set variants and roll with that or even better why not make it a set that mixes different classes. Like we have forbiden armor for mage-summoner and frost armor for ranged - melee.
We could have two helmets that using strong set bonuses make it eighter melee - summoner or ranged - mage hybrid armor

The goal of this is a option between 2 post golem armor sets for each class to give it a little diversity.

 

[Ferrin🌳]

The goal of this is a option between 2 post golem armor sets for each class to give it a little diversity.

so to add diversity our solution is make a one armor fits all? that just chanels everyone to martian madness, besides it's not like these armors offer anything unique in terms od stats and as long as that is the case there will always be a better of two armors
for example tiki armor is normaly not even a fraction of a competition to spooky but has it's own small region coz it gives whip range, so for whips only runs it is better
(that's why i was thinking about hybrid armors coz they remove the idea of competition between sets, they are their own thing)

(edit: the set bonuses are decent, that i like)