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the item "g*psy robe" has a racial slur in it.

Falloutguy645

Spazmatism
I don’t think it should get changed, as I’d imagine most Romani people don’t play the game. And what’s offensive in one language and not in another is not uncommon. Saying “sp*stic” (but with an a) is offensive in the U.K. but is completely normal in the U.S. Should the U.S. stop using the word to fit the U.K.’s needs? I’d argue no.
 

Lord Garak

Retinazer
I don’t think it should get changed, as I’d imagine most Romani people don’t play the game. And what’s offensive in one language and not in another is not uncommon. Saying “sp*stic” (but with an a) is offensive in the U.K. but is completely normal in the U.S. Should the U.S. stop using the word to fit the U.K.’s needs? I’d argue no.
I never noticed the armor name was changed, how pointless.
 

Calen

Skeletron Prime
I don’t think it should get changed, as I’d imagine most Romani people don’t play the game. And what’s offensive in one language and not in another is not uncommon. Saying “sp*stic” (but with an a) is offensive in the U.K. but is completely normal in the U.S. Should the U.S. stop using the word to fit the U.K.’s needs? I’d argue no.
Being normalised doesn't make it acceptable. Homophobic language was normal for the longest time, but thankfully is now unacceptable.

By saying offensive language is "normal" one implies that the sentiment behind the language is normal, and that should not be the case.
 

JohannSimm

Retinazer
You have my support. I don't think it would be a bad thing at all if the name of this item were changed. I can myself testify, based on my readings from around the web, that many Romani people do indeed find this term offensive, and most of those who self-identify as such still don't appreciate its wanton use by non-Romani. And I doubt that many Romani at all find much to appreciate in the stereotypes of fortune tellers and curses that abound in North American pop culture, which this item conjures up (so to speak) with its magic stats boosts. It shouldn't be too much trouble to change the item's title to something like "Mystic Robe" or "Arcane Robe", both of which still communicate the item's purpose perfectly well without relying on the language of hackneyed stereotypes.

An item with this sort of title, I think, would be less acceptable were it referring to a different race – for example, a martial arts themed-item with an Asian racial slur in its title. But that sort of thing has become considerably less acceptable over time, and most people today would widely denounce it. Awareness of racism towards Romani is much less developed in the West; a lot of the fortune teller stereotypes, or even the stereotype of Romani being thieves, are still widely acceptable or go unquestioned. In North America the stereotypes tend to be more fanciful, compounded by a lack of awareness of the actual oppressed ethnic group behind the stereotypes. But in many parts of Europe the Romani are overwhelmingly despised and discriminated against by the majority of the non-Romani population, an animosity founded on centuries-old stereotypes of Romani as baby-kidnappers and thieves.

I'll get off my soapbox now. I don't expect that many will appreciate this message, but I said what I came here to say.
 
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Blob [FBI]

Terrarian
You have my support. I don't think it would be a bad thing at all if the name of this item were changed. I can myself testify, based on my readings from around the web, that many Romani people do indeed find this term offensive, and most of those who self-identify as such still don't appreciate its wanton use by non-Romani. And I doubt that many Romani at all find much to appreciate in the stereotypes of fortune tellers and curses that abound in North American pop culture, which this item conjures up (so to speak) with its magic stats boosts. It shouldn't be too much trouble to change the item's title to something like "Mystic Robe" or "Arcane Robe", both of which still communicate the item's purpose perfectly well without relying on the language of hackneyed stereotypes.

An item with this sort of title, I think, would be less acceptable were it referring to a different race – for example, a martial arts themed-item with an Asian racial slur in its title. But that sort of thing has become considerably less acceptable over time, and most people today would widely denounce it. Awareness of racism towards Romani is much less developed in the West; a lot of the fortune teller stereotypes, or even the stereotype of Romani being thieves, are still widely acceptable or go unquestioned. In North America the stereotypes tend to be more fanciful, compounded by a lack of awareness of the actual oppressed ethnic group behind the stereotypes. But in many parts of Europe the Romani are overwhelmingly despised and discriminated against by the majority of the non-Romani population, an animosity founded on centuries-old stereotypes of Romani as baby-kidnappers and thieves.

I'll get off my soapbox now. I don't expect that many will appreciate this message, but I said what I came here to say.
Yeah I get the reasoning why its offensive but the game isnt directly using the racial side of the word
Like how gay use to mean happy. Re-Logic isnt racist, and they item in general isnt suppose to be used for that kinda message, the gypsy robe is using a name that isnt connected with the offensive version.

But sure, if they wanna change it go ahead, it aint gonna end the whole game and ruin it....
 

Falloutguy645

Spazmatism
Being normalised doesn't make it acceptable. Homophobic language was normal for the longest time, but thankfully is now unacceptable.

By saying offensive language is "normal" one implies that the sentiment behind the language is normal, and that should not be the case.
Not my point. Sp*stic (I will continue to censor it for anyone in the U.K.) is normal in the U.S. because it’s not offensive. It’s meaning in American - English is different from U.K. - English. For us Americans, it simply means someone who has excessive energy and not even in a bad way. You brought up homophobic language being normal for the longest time is obviously not incorrect; the difference being homophobic language is (almost) universally accepted as offensive and sp*stic being offensive in only some areas.
 
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Gotcha!

Pumpking
The way I see it "Gypsy" doesn't have to mean anything racist; I double-checked this by googling the exact meaning of the word.

It's very important to see in what context a word is used, and in Terraria "Gypsy" has nothing to do with a racist slur. If there was an NPC called "Gypsy" and if it was clear that this NPC is basically a thief, sure, there would be a problem there. But we're talking about a set of clothes here.

What I find much more troublesome is some people trying to find racism where there's no racism. This behaviour does more damage than good and people should stop this.
 

JohannSimm

Retinazer
Yeah I get the reasoning why its offensive but the game isnt directly using the racial side of the word
Like how gay use to mean happy. Re-Logic isnt racist, and they item in general isnt suppose to be used for that kinda message, the gypsy robe is using a name that isnt connected with the offensive version.
I don't know. It seems fairly connected to the Romani people to me. The term "gay" wasn't associated with homosexuality in the past. The tern "g*psy" has always been associated with the Romani throughout history; it was created by outsiders because of the misconception that the Romani were from Egypt. And today it brings up a lot of painful history for them, particularly when used by non-Romani.

I'd also like to reassure you that I'm not trying to suggest that Re-Logic or anyone on the team is racist. It's mainly an issue of society at large having some misconceptions.

It’s just called Gypsy robe because it’s in the style of the traditional Gypsy.
That may well have been the intent, but know that this "traditional style" is in most cases a romanticized fabrication with little basis in history. The Hollywood version whitewashes out a lot of the persecution and the reasons they had to live the way they did, instead depicting them as "carefree spirits". The truth is far less romantic.

The reason Romani historically wore colorful clothing and travelled around in wagons is because they were so persecuted that nobody would allow them to stay anyplace for long – if they overstayed their welcome they'd probably be run out of town within the week by an angry mob. They dressed the way they did because they had to scrounge whatever discarded articles of clothing they could find, because they were so poor. And they reason that many now associate them with fortunetelling and musicianship (particularly fiddling) is because those were some of the few avenues available to them to make money; they were effectively barred from respectable employment.

In the end, the item is just a brown and purple robe with an "exotic" aesthetic. So it doesn't really have much relation to any specific style of clothing worn by the Romani – other than that which exists in the popular imagination.

The way I see it "Gypsy" doesn't have to mean anything racist; I double-checked this by googling the exact meaning of the word.

It's very important to see in what context a word is used, and in Terraria "Gypsy" has nothing to do with a racist slur. If there was an NPC called "Gypsy" and if it was clear that this NPC is basically a thief, sure, there would be a problem there. But we're talking about a set of clothes here.

What I find much more troublesome is some people trying to find racism where there's no racism. This behaviour does more damage than good and people should stop this.
I agree that the term, in this case, is certainly being used without any animus or ill will. However, the word is also tied to a long history of oppression in Europe. For the Romani, it has existing baggage that transcends intent.

I also agree that the hypothetical NPC you describe would be the far worse of the two instances. However, I don't think the current item is necessarily free of stereotype and misconception, even though it's definitely the lesser of two evils. (The "thieves and kidnappers" stereotype has historically been far more harmful to the Romani than the "carefree magical people" stereotype, although I must stress that I don't think that makes the second stereotype desirable by any means.)

Finally, I'd just like to say that I am glad this has so far remained a respectable discussion. The last time this topic was brought up on these forums years ago, it degenerated into a slugfest that had to be locked by the moderators. I'm glad to see that this has not happened so far. (Hopefully I didn't just jinx it.)
 

ChimeraWarden

The Destroyer
b r u h
It’s just a piece of clothing. Barely anybody has one and even less actually use it.

What I find much more troublesome is some people trying to find racism where there's no racism. This behaviour does more damage than good and people should stop this.
 

Fuzzy_TK

Steampunker
I don't get why this is such a big deal.
I am Romanian, and I can assure you that the armor "Gypsy Robe" Isn't offensive. Sure, the term "gypsy" has a lot of history behind it as @JohannSimm said, but Re-Logic surely didn't had any racial motives when adding the item.
I don't see why it should be changed, because it isn't offensive in the game, and I'm pretty sure no Romanian that played the game had an episode when they saw the armor. But Re-Logic could change the name, if enough people ask for it, which I doubt they will.
 

JohannSimm

Retinazer
I don't get why this is such a big deal.
I am Romanian, and I can assure you that the armor "Gypsy Robe" Isn't offensive. Sure, the term "gypsy" has a lot of history behind it as @JohannSimm said, but Re-Logic surely didn't had any racial motives when adding the item.
I don't see why it should be changed, because it isn't offensive in the game, and I'm pretty sure no Romanian that played the game had an episode when they saw the armor. But Re-Logic could change the name, if enough people ask for it, which I doubt they will.
I hear what you’re saying, but I’d just like to point out the common misconception that Romani = Romanian, at least outside of the Romanian language. The word “g*psy” doesn’t refer specifically to Romanians, but instead to an ethnic group with a similar-sounding name. In fact, the plural names are identical in the Romanian language: “Romani” is the plural for Romanian people. However, the Romani ethnic group is also distinct from that. In some places a double-r spelling, “Rromani”, is used to reduce confusion.

There are Rromani in Romania, as there are in many countries in Europe (and they’re as oppressed there as they are anywhere in Europe), but the majority of Romanians are no more Rromani than the majority populations of France or Italy.

Although they sound similar – and as I’ve mentioned, appear identical in the Romanian language – the names don’t even have a common linguistic root. The country of Romania is named after the city of Rome, which is a Latin source, whereas “Rromani” comes from the Rromani word “Rom” (meaning “man”).

Genetic research has shown that the Rromani most likely emigrated out of India many centuries ago and crossed over into Europe. Further evidence for this is that many words in the Rromani language have significant similarity to Sanskrit words – for example, another proposed origin of “Rromani” or “Roma” (plural for Rromani people) is the Sanskrit word “doma” – referring to a person from a low caste of travelling entertainers.
 

Falloutguy645

Spazmatism
I'm not familiar with this saying
It’s not a saying, it’s used more as an insult. Either way before someone gets too heated, just remember the “I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it” quote.

@JohannSimm I got what you were saying in your post before your most recent one, but I still disagree with changing it’s name. With what @ChimeraWarden said in their post, it’s really just a piece of clothing in the game. I believe you can’t pinpoint it being “offensive” because of that fact. Anyways, that’s my opinion.
 
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